Item 6 on our agenda this afternoon is a debate on the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee report, 'The State of Roads in Wales'. I call on the Chair of that committee to move the motion—Russell George.

Motion NDM6907 Russell George

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales:

Notes the report of the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee, 'The State of Roads in Wales', which was laid in the Table Office on 24 October 2018.

Motion moved.

An audio-visual presentation was shown to accompany the debate. 

Diolch, Deputy Presiding Officer. I move the motion in my name. The condition of Wales's roads is a matter of great importance to all of us. Whether we drive, cycle, or take the bus, we're all road users in one way or another. The everyday things that sustain us, including much of our food, are, of course, transported via the roads.

In addition to the importance to us all as part of our lives, the road network is one of the nation’s greatest assets also, worth an estimated £13.5 billion, and covers over 21,000 miles. Our inquiry has looked in detail at how we maintain our roads, how we improve them, and whether this approach meets the expectations the Welsh Government has set itself in the laws it has passed.

Committee members were mindful of how much the public talk about the state of our roads, so we were keen to enable people to contribute to our work. We therefore held a photographic competition to encourage people from all parts of Wales to submit images that represent the network. The images we received are playing on the screens here in the Chamber, and covered a wide range—some funny, some sweeping landscapes and some pothole-ridden tarmac.

The Minister will recall that he accepted many, but not all, of our recommendations. One of the sobering aspects of this inquiry has been how many of the issues raised in previous studies remain difficult. There is an overwhelming consensus that long-term funding for local government and trunk road agencies would lead to improvements, yet we remain stuck in an annual cycle. Twelve months ago, in a statement on the future of Transport for Wales, the then Cabinet Secretary said that he had:

'committed to a five-year programme of transport capital funding through Transport for Wales.'

He claimed that this would lead to 15 to 20 per cent efficiencies. 

The committee recommended that the five-year funding model that was being applied to Transport for Wales—or rather is—is also applied to local authorities. However, the Government has rejected that call. While saying that it's sympathetic to such calls, the formal response sets out a number of reasons why this is difficult right now. It refers to the fact that local authorities receive funding from a range of sources, not just the Welsh Government. It also cities uncertainty around the planned UK Government spending review, combined with austerity and Brexit. While it commits to working with local government to provide

‘indicative information to inform their forward planning’, it’s unclear how this funding uncertainty affects the five-year programme of capital funding committed for Transport for Wales, so I hope the Minister will be able to clarify why the two bodies see such a different approach.

If there was one key thing to take away from our report—one recommendation we considered in detail—it was this one, recommendation 12:

'The forthcoming Wales Transport Strategy should set a clear priority for maintaining the existing road network, mainstreaming and upgrading active travel infrastructure, and prioritising access, in preference to building new roads.'

I am disappointed that the Government rejected this recommendation.

Now, we know that money is tight, and we know that there is a strain on the current network and there's a strain on the cost of maintaining it, but we also know that investing and maintaining saves money in the longer term. The committee and the Minister have indicated the need for greater spending on active travel infrastructure. It seems unlikely that this will be possible on any scale without re-prioritising the spend within the transport budget. In addition to these financial reasons, there is the pressure provided by the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 to consider the wider impacts of investment. More roads equals more traffic, equals more pollution.

I should make clear that I—my views and the committee's views—. I’m not saying that we don’t build new roads. That's not what we’re saying at all—far from it. We're about to see the opening of the Newtown bypass in my own constituency—a massive infrastructure project much needed for many, many years. There are cases where roads need to be moved, or addressing pinch points would be the best possible solution. So, our recommendation is about a focus on the other activities, rather than saying, 'Don't build new roads'. [Interruption.] Yes, of course. 

Thank you very much, Russell, for giving way. It's an important point, particularly in respect of the Active Travel (Wales) Act 2013, which he mentioned. When it was passed back in 2013, it talked about making walking and cycling the most natural way of getting about in Wales but, of course, we know that when roadworks are done on existing road infrastructure, it's very often the walkers and the cyclists that are the forgotten ones, the most inconvenienced. It tends to be the cycle paths that tend to be used as the overspill from the roadworks and they're blocked—there's no diversion, no alternatives taking their place. Despite the fact that Welsh Government has made it clear that it wants that to happen, it doesn't seem to happen. And I think one of the—. I'm interested in whether the committee looked at this aspect of whether the delivery guidance for the design guidance under the Act properly addressed this issue because, surely, if we're trying to promote active travel and make this the most natural country in which to walk and cycle, then, when we do any roadworks, new or old, we want to make sure that the cycle lanes and the walkways are still there, and we're not pushing people out into the middle of traffic or into a field. 

Well, as it happens, we did look into that in a separate piece of work that we did last year in regard to active travel. We actually undertook our own survey of users that asked, 'What stops you from cycling or using paths?' and it was, indeed, the state of roads. And I think that is in line with what you're saying, so I very much agree with that point; I think it's a point well made. 

The committee made a number of recommendations that I’m pleased to say have been accepted, and these include exploring the potential of apps to provide real-time feedback on road conditions, improving the transparency and availability of highway asset management plans, creating a panel of experts to advise on best practice in road mending, and limiting the cases where it might be prudent to use the mutual investment model of public-private financing. On the latter note, the Chair of the Finance Committee wrote to me earlier this week responding to our concerns about the mutual investment model, and I was pleased to read that they will be doing a wider piece of work on capital funding during the coming year that will consider these issues.

I anticipate lots of contributions today, as lots of us will receive e-mails and letters about the state of roads in our own regions and constituencies, so I look forward to hearing what others have to say this afternoon. 

In Wales, we have just under 35,000 km of roads. Most people's journeys involve the use of the road network, a figure that has been static since records began in the 1950s. We also rely on roads for a high proportion of our domestic freight. Across the UK, Cycling UK’s 'Fill that Hole' website notes an average of 13,500 potholes reported annually. Both of these statistics indicate something of the scale of the challenge before us, and they also show that the condition of our roads is a topic of concern to many Welsh citizens, a point that the Chair of our committee, Russell George, has already noted. 

For my contribution to today’s debate, I want to focus on three recommendations in particular, and it's disappointing that all of these have been rejected by the Welsh Government. So, I would hope the Minister in his response could look at how the evidence we received may be taken on board. First, recommendation 3: now, this was about incentivising local authorities to invest in maintenance. In my own local authority of Rhondda Cynon Taf, plans were recently approved to invest a further £23.5 million over the next three years. A sustained focus on improving the highway network means that, since 2011-12, the percentage of classified roads requiring attention there has shrunk by two thirds.

I want to commend the council for their hard work in improving the road network, which has seen the completion of over 1,000 carriageway schemes. I welcome the Welsh Government's substantial funding to local councils over a four-year period for road maintenance. However, I hope the Minister could outline how he will best work with councils to ensure that this remains a priority. I'm very conscious that it's all well and good residents of one authority having well-maintained roads, but what if they travel to another authority where the situation is very different? Maintenance of roads in one authority is perhaps the service that can most affect residents living in another. So, we need to make sure that we adopt a joined-up approach to this issue.

Secondly, recommendation 4: now, this is about looking at a five-year model for support for councils. Key here is the capacity for long-term planning at all levels. I do accept the Minister's reasoning and note that, where possible, funding has been provided on a longer term basis. For example, I alluded to the £60 million pothole fund allocated to authorities over a three-year basis. I mentioned that councils can make long-term plans, as in the case of Rhondda Cynon Taf and its three-year model.

I think the more positive response to recommendation 6 addresses some of our concerns. With the continuing pressure of austerity, we need to ensure that we make the right long-term decisions that deliver the right long-term solutions. That's better than quick short-term fixes, which only lead to further cost overall. I look forward to the publication of the five-year maintenance plan referred to in due course.

Finally, recommendation 8: at its core, this is around clarity and prioritisation of road infrastructure improvements, and explaining, when timescales slip, why this is the case. I think this is vitally important. One of the sources of greatest frustration to my constituents has been the delays in completing the dualling of the A465 Heads of the Valleys road between Hirwaun and Abergavenny. Now, the need for improvements to that three-lane very dangerous stretch of road were identified nearly three decades ago. The slippage in the time frame on this long-promised project, often without clear answers why or when, has left a bitter taste. I would say it's no coincidence that my party has struggled to hold the council seat in the ward of Hirwaun, one of only two seats that we've failed to hold in the Cynon Valley.

Similarly, whatever Members' views on the M4 relief road, questions about the timescale there have not benefited anyone. I think it's important to note the sense of frustration may not be just about road replacement projects. It also affects public transport improvements too. I welcome the Welsh Government’s commitment to review whether greater clarity can be given as to the stages of development within the national transport finance plan. I hope that this can be made as clear as possible so politicians and the communities we represent all have the right information. Thank you.

I'm grateful for the opportunity to speak on the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee report on the state of roads in Wales. May I begin my remarks this afternoon by paying tribute to my predecessor on the committee, Mark Isherwood, for all his work in helping to produce this valuable report? The state of the roads in Wales is a vitally important subject that affects the lives of everyone in Wales. We all use the roads as drivers or passengers, for leisure or for work or for just getting on with our daily lives.

Roads are vital for the Welsh economy. The Federation of Small Businesses pointed out that its members frequently complain that the state of our roads is getting worse and that congestion is hampering their businesses. They went on to say that, when questioned, most businesses' priority for investment was transport infrastructure. A survey in 2014 revealed that over 60 per cent of FSB members said that roadworks, congestion and the state of repair of roads were having a negative impact on their businesses. In 2016, another survey suggested that congestion and the state of repair of local roads, as opposed to the strategic trunk road network, was a significant concern.

Local roads are of course looked after by local authorities rather than by the Welsh Government. Indeed, the Welsh Government's own published data shows that the condition of local roads is significantly worse than the trunk roads or motorways. There can be no doubt that the problem of maintaining local roads has been exacerbated by cuts in local authorities' funding. Many responses to the committee made clear that local roads would deteriorate if funding levels were not maintained. I welcome the announcement that was made back in February last year of an extra £30 million for local road improvements, but this is only a fraction of the sum required. Swansea city council, for example, itself estimates the cost of this backlog of repairs at £54 million. The committee concluded that funding for local roads needed a longer term approach than that provided by the current annual settlement system. It is disappointing, therefore, to note that the two recommendations made regarding funding have been rejected by the Welsh Government, and yet there is a precedent for a longer term deal. Transport for Wales already benefits from a five-year programme of capital funding. If Transport for Wales can receive this certainty of funding, why shouldn't local authorities also be able to benefit?

In the current financial climate, local authority budgets are under severe pressure. It is unlikely that they will be able to find the significant additional funding that maintenance of the infrastructure requires. Innovative ways need to be found to incentivise local authorities to invest in essential maintenance. I would ask the Welsh Government to reconsider their rejection of those two recommendations.

Deputy Presiding Officer, it is not enough to take comfort from the conclusion that the condition of Wales's roads is not worse than those in other parts of the United Kingdom. Although this may be true, this issue is far too important for us to be complacent. We must face the challenge presented by the current state of the roads in Wales. I believe the recommendations in this report do just that and would significantly improve our road network for everyone's benefit. As the now Deputy Minister was one of the members of the committee who actually signed off those recommendations, I hope the Government will look sympathetically on this, and I commend this report to the Assembly. Thank you.

I will speak very briefly. I wasn't a member of the committee that carried out this inquiry, and, oddly enough, there was some mockery when that competition was launched for people to send in pictures of potholes to the committee. Some doubted the seriousness of that, but it was an useful step, and what was shown in people's response was just how much this touches the lives of people wherever they are in Wales. Our roads, after all, are one of our greatest assets, worth over £13 billion, and each and every one of us in one way or another uses those roads, and each and every one of us, I would go so far as to say, have come across potholes in our roads. It was a very useful exercise, I think, in real engagement between our national Parliament and the people of Wales on an issue that was truly important to them.

And there were no prizes for thinking what some of the conclusions of this inquiry would be, nor what some of the recommendations that would emerge would be, but it was very important indeed that they were noted in black and white, and I'm very pleased that we do have this report. It was no surprise to see through this report that funding is too tight within our local authorities in Wales for them, without additional support, to tackle this particular problem; it was no surprise to see that we needed a long-term funding plan, as other elements of our transport system receive; it was no surprise to see that long-term management and ensuring that this asset was maintained in the best possible condition for the longer term would be more cost-effective than responding to problems as they arise, and we have recommendations now that I hope that the Government will implement.

But there's no getting away from the fact that there is a dire financial problem at the core of this situation. The annual local authority road maintenance survey, which was drawn to my attention today, suggests that local authorities in Wales had spent 40 per cent less than local authorities in England on road maintenance in 2018. That’s not sustainable. I understand in my constituency that the funding available for road maintenance has almost halved in a period of around 10 years. That is not sustainable. I see one authority talking about a backlog of £50 million for road maintenance. The statistics from Swansea have again been drawn to my attention today.

And a situation can deteriorate over time. I’ve had a case in my own constituency recently where a change in agricultural practice, heavier vehicles being used on rural roads, does exacerbate the problems and causes problems anew for rural roads, and that, in turn, leads to further costs. So, this isn’t a problem that’s going to go away; it’s a problem that we have to take seriously.

And one can’t ignore the fact that, in Wales, at the moment, there are road schemes worth up to some £2 billion in the pipeline—that could happen for one scheme, and there are other significant schemes worth tens or hundreds of millions of pounds and we must safeguard the fundamental asset. We must safeguard that asset and we must put long-term spending programmes in place— five years is the suggestion made in this report, and I would agree with that—long-term funding schemes in order to ensure that our local authorities can put programmes in place in order to safeguard that asset for the longer term. And I’m very pleased that this report has been drawn up, never mind the mockery of the photography competition at its start.

Well, echoing some of the words of Rhun ap Iorwerth, during our evidence sessions on the state of the roads in Wales, many, if not all, stakeholders were adamant that there was a need for longer strategic planning, and this could only be achieved by long-term budget proposals from the Welsh Government, most advocating this be at least for a term of five years. It is therefore regrettable that recommendation 4 in our report is rejected by the Cabinet Minister. Although an explanation is given for this rejection, should Government not acknowledge that short-term solutions to the road network are far more costly over time than well-thought-out medium to long-term projects? So, it seems strange that you accept our recommendation 6, which, again, calls for long-term planning, although this acceptance seems to be based on better, longer-lasting, road metalling materials.

Given that financial restraints are the primary cause for the Government's inability to facilitate long-term budgets, should such restraints be a fundamental factor in the Cabinet Minister's deliberations over whether to go forward with the M4 relief road? Surely the release of the huge capital sum envisaged for the bypass would alleviate all the restraints outlined in your rejection of the suggestions contained in the committee's recommendation 4.

Turning to the Government's rejection of recommendation 12, where we asked that there should be a clear priority given to maintenance of existing roads, and enhancement of the active travel network, your rejection simply states that it is the national transport finance plan that sets out the investment programme, not the Wales transport strategy. However, does this address the fundamental principle of our recommendation, which addresses the question of prioritisation, given that both the strategy and the finance plan are both under the remit of the Welsh Government?

In conclusion, the two fundamental findings our inquiry's identified are that the trunk roads of Wales are generally of good standard and are being upgraded in a timely and cost-effective manner. However, the same cannot be said for the road network administered by local authorities, and that this is mainly due to financial constraints. We therefore call upon the Welsh Government to rectify this imbalance so that those using the network in Wales find all roads are maintained to an excellent and safe standard.

One area that I would like a particular focus on is the surface water flooding, and when we took evidence, Leeds university mentioned climate change in their evidence to the committee, and particularly, the increased incidence of heavy rainfall, which, in its turn, increases flooding. I note that sustainable drainage systems for new properties have come into force this week. However, dealing with flood risk and aquaplaning, which is potentially lethal in its consequences, must be written, I believe, into both road building and maintenance schedules, whether that is maintained by local government or other highway bodies. I look forward to it being included in the five-year maintenance plan. 

I do welcome the extra funding that has come into local government, particularly to address this problem in response to its needs, but I will be and will remain consistent about surface water flooding, because the outcome and the result of it can be absolutely lethal.

I'd like to thank the Finance Committee for their report. The state of our roads is one of the frequent complaints I receive as an Assembly Member. Anyone who uses any of Wales’s 21,000 miles of road will tell you that many of those roads are in a poor state of repair. Avoiding potholes has become a fixture in our daily commute.

According to the Asphalt Industry Alliance, it will take over 24 years and more than £0.5 billion to get Wales’s roads up to scratch. We have a massive backlog of road repairs, which has also led to increases in compensation and insurance pay-outs due to damage and injury caused by potholes. Potholes are one of the leading causes of car accidents on our roads and are responsible for the death or serious injury of many cyclists each year. Local authority cuts and a couple of harsh winters have contributed to a sharp rise in the number of potholes plaguing our highways and byways. Without extra investment and forward planning, our roads will deteriorate much further, well beyond the ability to apply a quick patch. Poorly patched potholes can make the situation much worse, as road salt and below-freezing water during the winter months undermine the patch, often leading to an even bigger pothole.

Forecasters are predicting yet another harsh winter, which will further undermine the condition of our road network. I therefore welcome the Economy, Infrastructure and Skills Committee’s recommendations and regret that the Welsh Government have failed to accept them all. The roads in the worst state of repair are our local roads—the responsibility of Wales’s 22 councils—yet the Welsh Government refuses to ensure ring-fenced funds for our roads or to ensure that we move away from year-to-year budgeting to more strategic transport investment plans. It is this short-sightedness that has led us to where we are today, where roads are left to deteriorate until they are almost unusable, then hastily and shoddily patched and allowed to deteriorate further before they are eventually resurfaced.

We need to move away from this reactionary approach and take a more strategic approach towards our national infrastructure. A properly planned and adequately financed programme of road repairs and surface replacement is badly needed. We also need to look at ways in which technology can help address the issue of potholes. New machinery and new developments in bonding agents mean repairs can last longer than the original road surface. New advances in road surface material science has led to the creation of self-healing roads, which are being built in the Netherlands and China.

We need to ensure that our roads, the lifeblood of our economy, are fit for the future by ensuring that we utilise the very latest technology, which will undoubtedly lead to future cost savings as well as reducing the number of accidents, deaths and serious injuries that occur on Welsh roads. With these points in mind, I urge the Minister to reconsider his opposition to recommendations 3 and 4. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much. Can I now call the Minister for Economy and Transport, Ken Skates?

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. It's a great pleasure to be able to respond to this important debate today. I'd like to begin by thanking the Chair and the members of the committee for their hard work. I'd like to thank all Members who have contributed this afternoon, and I'd also like to thank the Chair of the committee for providing the complementary visuals to today's debate. I hasn't realised that the photographic competition had drawn any scorn; I actually think it's a really innovative way of attracting interest from the people that we serve in the work that we do, and I'd like to congratulate the committee for deciding to hold that competition.

Deputy Presiding Officer, I've always been very clear, throughout my time in office, that the Welsh Government is committed to a high-quality, integrated, low-carbon and multimodal transport system that can support our communities, our economy, our public services, right across the length and breadth of Wales. I know that the public perception might be that the Welsh Government is stuffed full of road engineers that only want to build new roads—I've heard the joke many times before—but it is simply not true. Look at what we've put forward as a Government in recent years. Proposals for a new £5 billion rail service, exciting new plans for metros in the north and in the south, a big increase in active travel investment, and a major new public transport White Paper proposing ambitious reform of our bus and taxi sectors, I think, prove that point.

But whatever the future looks like, having a reliable and well-maintained road network that can serve those communities and regional economies I talked about is a vital part of the equation. At over 1,700 km in length, the motorway and trunk road network is one of our most valuable assets, worth approximately £16 billion. Through improving connectivity and boosting economic activity, it supports the delivery of many of the objectives in 'Prosperity for All' and the 'Wales Infrastructure Investment Plan'. To put it simply, we are responsible for three areas: we are responsible for constructing new roads and improving the existing ones; we are responsible for renewing roads, bridges and other structures; and we're also responsible for the day-to-day road maintenance of the trunk road network and motorway network, including, of course—crucially—winter maintenance. 

Work is continually required across the network to ensure its safety, and work is currently managed by two public sector agents: the South Wales Trunk Road Agent, managed by Neath Port Talbot council; and in the north and mid Wales, it's the North and Mid Wales Trunk Road Agent, which is managed by Gwynedd County Council. And I think it is fair to say that recent harsh winters have not been kind whatsoever to the network, causing significant disruption, and we've experienced a rapid deterioration in road surface conditions, due to the freeze-thaw cycle across Wales that many Members today have talked about. But even during these challenging times we continue to operate, maintain and upgrade the network, allowing 10 billion vehicle kilometres of use per year throughout all seasons. The nature of the work is incredibly costly, and in the last financial year, we invested over £146 million in maintenance and minor improvements alone. We'll continue to focus on ensuring value for money and driving efficiency in all of our transport schemes. With regard to recommendation 4, we recognise and we are sympathetic to the calls from our public sector partners and businesses for budgeting over a longer period whenever possible, in order to support forward financial planning, but our ambition to publish plans for longer than 12 months must be balanced with our ability to provide realistic and sensible planning assumptions.

Our capital budget is 10 per cent lower in real terms than at the start of this decade, and potholes are a clear, visible and daily reminder of the UK Government's austerity programme. The continuing financial uncertainty and the considerable insecurity surrounding the shape and nature of the negotiations for a future deal with the European Union mean that we have taken the decision to publish capital plans for the next two years, 2019-20 and 2020-21—the period for which we have a known settlement. An additional £32.5 million of specific grants were allocated in the last financial year to local authorities to improve the condition of the road network, and we'll be providing a further £60 million specifically for highway refurbishment over the three years between 2018-19 and 2021-22. Decisions on local roads and the prioritisation of repairs and improvements are, rightly in my view, matters for local decision makers.

An extra £100 million general capital being provided between 2018-19 and 2021-22 as part of the additional funding package for local government announced in November will go a huge way to support local councils in improving the condition of their road network, and allow them to deliver other local transport priorities, which of course are much more widely appreciated than just road users.

We are progressing major projects to improve the road network across Wales, particularly at pinch points where congestion can be a major problem. By making our network more efficient we not only improve productivity, but also enhance access to jobs, services and leisure. Rectifying pinch points can also play an important role in overall emissions reductions, as well as providing significant air quality, noise and active travel benefits for local communities.

Our national transport finance plan sets out an ambitious five-year rolling programme of transport interventions that we are taking forward across Wales, and the plan was updated in December of 2017 with an intention to review on an annual basis to reflect developments over time and the changing profile of needs across Wales. The current Wales transport strategy is also under review, having originally been published in 2008. That strategy, which will be published this year, will provide an opportunity to adopt new approaches and engage with stakeholders during key stages of its development. Officials are already engaging with the Future Generations Commissioner for Wales on the direction of this strategy, and we also worked with the future generations commissioner to launch the Welsh transport appraisal guidance.

To complement our capital budget, we have also developed a range of innovative financing schemes, including the mutual investment model, to finance major capital projects. This will support additional investment in social and economic infrastructure projects and will help to improve public services across our country. The MIM includes important provisions to promote the public interest. The model extends the Government's approach to community benefits, which have been a key feature of the other schemes delivered to date. It also incorporates our commitments to ethical employment and sustainable development, and will contribute to the delivery of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. We've made it clear that the mutual investment model will only be used when other forms of capital have been exhausted. I know that officials have already briefed the committee on the model, but further briefing will be provided during the procurement of the first MIM scheme, which is to complete the dualling of the Heads of the Valleys road, the A465.

Officials continue to liaise with various practitioners throughout the UK to share best practice, including Transport Scotland, Highways England and local contractors. This has resulted in a new specification for road surfacing suitable to meet the challenge of durability, sustainability and the environmental effects of climate change. We're also fully aware that mobile apps are increasingly become the norm, and that they could be incredibly useful in assisting with maintenance planning. It's recognised industry wide that current surveys lack an effective real-time approach, and the geographical information system would be able to highlight condition issues and inform planned maintenance decision making on a rolling basis.

So, in conclusion, Welsh Ministers are directly responsible for the motorway and trunk road network in Wales and have a statutory duty to maintain its safety and operation. We will continue our sustained investment in the maintenance and improvement of this critical asset.

The Llywydd took the Chair.

Russell George to reply to the debate.

Diolch, Presiding Officer. I'd like to thank all Members for taking part in this debate this afternoon. I think all Members, or many Members at least—particularly Vikki Howells and David Rowlands—focused their contributions on the recommendations that were not accepted by the Government. Oscar Asghar thanked past member Mark Isherwood for his work on the inquiry. I fully support that as well, but in the interests of fairness I should also like to thank other past members, including Lee Waters, for their contribution to our inquiry and our work as well. Of course, Lee Waters is now the Deputy Minister for Economy and Transport and I know that he will be working hard trying to persuade the Minister that our recommendations—in fact, his recommendations—that were not accepted should have indeed been accepted. And I should mention Adam Price as well for he was also a member of the committee during this time, and very much made mention of the app that the Minister referred to in the latter part of his contribution, as well as one of our recommendations.

There was indeed some mocking of our photographic competition, as Rhun mentioned, but largely it was complimentary. And some of the mocking was indeed helpful mocking. Some constituents of my own sent me pictures and didn't submit them formally. I've one picture of somebody fishing in a pothole, sat there on their chair with their fishing rod disappearing into the hole in front of them. But, of course, our competition did create discussion and was particularly useful I think, as well. And I'd like to thank all those who did submit photographs and who shared their photographs with us in this inquiry. I'd also like to thank the Welsh Government trunk roads staff who asked us to share details of the worst holes that we received in case they weren't aware of them as well.

Mend before we build was an issue that a number of Members mentioned during their contributions and I think that this is an important message for communities and to politicians that building more roads should indeed be a last resort rather than the first resort.

The Minister in his response did refer to recommendation 4 regarding budgeting and longer term budgeting for local authorities and trunk road agencies. I do hear your comments. I know the Minister is sympathetic to what we were suggesting, although that recommendation wasn't accepted, and I do understand the points that he makes. But I do think, and I would reiterate again, that longer term planning and longer term budgeting allow better decision making and savings in the long term. But I, again, just hope your Deputy Minister will persuade you of that argument as time goes on.

Evangelist.

I'd also like to thank the friendly road crew working for Cardiff council who showed some of the incredible equipment that was being used to fix the surface on a housing estate near Castell Coch. I undertook the visit by myself and it was amazing to see that equipment in action. At one point, if I hadn't moved quickly, I would have been part of that new refurbished road, but I do thank the staff there that supported us as well. And I'd like to thank the committee team, the committee clerking team and the research team, for all their work as well.

I hope that this debate has highlighted the importance of keeping our roads in good condition, not just for cars but for public transport, for transporting goods and for encouraging cycling as well. And, of course, the points that Huw Irranca-Davies made are completely valuable as well in terms of other work that we have done, as I mentioned.

I look forward to seeing how the Minister and his deputy take forward this agenda to deliver better roads in the future. Diolch yn fawr.

The proposal is to note the committee's report. Does any Member object? No. Therefore, the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.