The following amendments have been selected: amendments 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 in the name of Darren Millar.

Item 8 on the agenda this afternoon is the Plaid Cymru debate on the Kurds in Turkey. I call on Delyth Jewell to move the motion. Delyth.

Motion NDM6999 Rhun ap Iorwerth

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales:

1. Notes that, whilst foreign affairs is a matter currently reserved to the UK Government and Parliament, Section 62 of the Government of Wales Act 2006 provides that 'The Welsh Ministers, the First Minister and the Counsel General may make appropriate representations about any matter affecting Wales'.

2. Recognises the substantial Kurdish community in Wales.

3. Notes that a resident of Wales—İmam Sis, a young Kurdish man—is on an indefinite, non-alternating hunger strike as of 17 December 2018, which was initiated to protest the isolation of the Kurdish leader Abdullah Öcalan who has been imprisoned by Turkey since 1999 under conditions which are understood to contravene the Turkish state’s legal obligations in relation to human rights.

4. Notes that hunger strikes are taking place across Europe and the world, including by Leyla Güven, an elected member of the Turkish Parliament.

5. Notes that Turkey is a signatory to several international human rights treaties, including the European Convention of Human Rights as a member of the Council of Europe.

6. Expresses its concern at the reasons behind the hunger strikes.

7. Recognises that the ultimate aim of the hunger strikes is to see a peaceful, political solution to the Kurdish question in Turkey.

8. Affirms the importance that human rights obligations are upheld in Turkey.

9. Calls on the Welsh Government, on behalf of the National Assembly for Wales, to write to the Committee for the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment calling for the committee to visit Imrali Prison to assess the conditions of Abdullah Öcalan.

Motion moved.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I'm proud to open today's debate on this motion. It's a matter of double importance to me, partly because I'm spokesperson for international affairs, but also because Imam Sis, who has inspired us to table today's debate, lives in Newport, and that falls within my region. I anticipate that Members on other sides of this Chamber will have differing views about what's got us to this point, and there'll come a time for us to debate those points, but let's begin with the human life that is at stake here, not 15 miles from where we stand at this very minute. 

I'll say his name again, because God knows he hasn't had the attention he should have had to date: Imam Sis. Imam has been on hunger strike for 94 days and he's done that in protest at the Turkish state's treatment of the Kurdish leader Abdullah Öcalan, who has been held in on-and-off solitary confinement since 1999, in contravention of international law. Imam is on this indefinite hunger strike alongside 300 of his compatriots, including Leyla Güven, who is a democratically elected Kurdish MP in the Turkish Parliament and who is now nearing death having refused food for 130 consecutive days. I implore Members to not dismiss what we're talking about here—people's lives. For that reason, I point out that our motion today is a straightforward one and we will not be accepting any of the proposed amendments. 

I have written to Leyla and to the secretariat for the European committee for the prevention of torture, and my letter called on them to review their investigation into the treatment of Mr Öcalan. The committee has looked into his case before now. Unfortunately, they do not have the necessary powers to ensure Mr Öcalan's human rights are enforced, which is why those campaigning for him have resorted to extreme measures to try to secure that his legal rights are honoured. 

Plaid Cymru welcomed the Welsh Government's decision to establish an international affairs ministry, and today is an opportunity for Wales to take its place on the international stage by being the first nation, through this Parliament and Government, to show its solidarity with the Kurdish people. Surely, it is incumbent on the National Assembly and Welsh Government to recognise and support the part that a Newport man is currently playing in an international struggle for justice, equality and human rights. I look forward to hearing Members' contributions and, truly, I hope for the support of the Labour benches as well, given that their party leader, Jeremy Corbyn, has also given his full support to the hunger strikers' cause. Diolch.

Thank you. I have selected the five amendments to the motion, and I call on Darren Millar to move amendments 1 to 5, tabled in his name.

Amendment 1—Darren Millar

In point 3, after ‘isolation of the Kurdish’, insert ‘PKK (Kurdistan Workers’ Party)’.

Amendment 2—Darren Millar

Insert new points after point 3 and renumber accordingly:

Notes that the PKK is a proscribed terrorist organisation in the UK, the European Union, and the United States of America.

Condemns all terrorist acts perpetrated by the PKK and acknowledges the victims and civilians killed and caught up in their attacks.

Acknowledges the right of Turkey to defend itself against terrorist attacks by the PKK.

Amendment 3—Darren Millar

Delete point 7 and replace with:

Recognises that the aim of the hunger strikers is to enable Abdullah Öcalan access to legal representation and contact with his family.

Amendment 4—Darren Millar

Insert new point after point 8 and renumber accordingly:

Notes that the UK Government’s Foreign Secretary and Her Majesty’s Ambassador to Turkey have emphasised to the Turkish government the need to respect human rights, avoid civilian casualties and return to the peace process.

Amendment 5—Darren Millar

Add as new point at end of motion:

Calls upon the PKK to abandon terrorism as a means to furthering its aims and return to the peace process.

Amendments 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 moved.

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I move the amendments tabled in my name. I have to say that many will call into question whether it's a good use of the National Assembly's time for us to be holding an opposition debate on foreign affairs and matters that are non-devolved, particularly at a time when Wales is facing huge domestic challenges that demand our attention. Many will also find it to be extremely distasteful that we're debating a motion today that sympathises with the leader and founding member of a prescribed terrorist organisation, especially given the dreadful attacks that have been perpetrated in Christchurch and Utrecht in recent days. 

As a person who has visited the Kurdistan region of Iraq just last year, and has Kurdish friends from Turkey and Iraq, I do recognise that there is a desire amongst many Kurdish people for an independent Kurdish state. But regardless of whether people in this Chamber support that aim or not, I would hope that we can all be united in our condemnation of the use of terror to achieve that goal. 

Now, I note that the motion before us refers to the ongoing hunger strike by Imam Sis, which was initiated to protest at the isolation of Abdullah Öcalan and to raise concern about Öcalan's human rights. I do not know Mr Sis, but from my research I gather he's a very sincere person, a very passionate man who believes in a future independent Kurdish state that values all of its citizens and upholds their rights. And I, like others in this Chamber, am moved by his plight, and I'm very concerned for his health, his well-being and his welfare, but I'm also very concerned about what appears to be the blind loyalty among some of the hunger-strikers to Abdullah Öcalan, the founder and leader of the Kurdistan Workers' Party, which is better known as the PKK. He was, of course, arrested back in 1999, as we've already heard, and he was arrested on terror and other related offences and has been in prison since. 

Now, in addition to being a proscribed terrorist organisation by the UK, the PKK is also considered to be a terrorist organisation by the EU—

The Llywydd took the Chair.

Will you take an intervention?

—by the EU, the United States, Japan and NATO.

Will you take an intervention?

The primary aim of the PKK, of course, has been to establish an independent Kurdish state in south-eastern Turkey, Syria and Iraq, but the PKK also wants to monopolise Kurdish political power, and it has done this by showing intolerance, suppressing opposition and attacking the interests of rival Kurdish political groups.

Will you take an intervention?

Since the establishment of the PKK back in 1978 on a far-left revolutionary Marxist philosophy, tens of thousands of people have died. 

Will you take an intervention?

Suicide bombs, car bombs, roadside bombs have been planted—

The Member is not taking an intervention. Allow the Member to continue.

—by the PKK and they have claimed the lives and changed the lives of many innocent civilians and their families, including children. The PKK has been accused of being involved in the narcotics trade, child smuggling, tax evasion and counterfeit-money production. As recently as 2016, Human Rights Watch alleged that groups affiliated to the PKK have recruited boys and girls to be soldiers in their cause. And the PKK, of course, continue to mount deadly terrorist attacks in Turkey.

Now, there have rightly been many questions asked of the actions of Turkey during the conflict that they have had with the PKK, including their treatment of prisoners. Now, clearly, Turkey has a legitimate right to defend itself against the PKK and terrorism, but, as is the case in any conflict, civilian casualties should always be avoided and human rights should always be fully respected and protected. Successive UK Governments have rightly urged the Turkish authorities to respect human rights, including the right to freedom of expression in the course of their anti-terror operations. And earlier this year, British Embassy officials discussed the imprisonment of Abdullah Öcalan with Turkish officials, including the issue of the hunger strikes by Leyla Güven and others. They have made it clear that the UK expects Turkey to ensure that prisoners' human rights are observed, including access to medical treatment and legal representation, and that all sides in this conflict, all stakeholders, need to return to the peace process. And to this end, the UK Government has provided funding to civil society organisations that are seeking to build dialogue between the different actors on the Kurdish issue, and I think we ought to recognise that in this debate.

Now, time has beaten me, but I do hope that Members will recognise that we've sought to clarify and give some context to this debate by making it clear with our amendments just what's behind the situation that we find ourselves in, and we have the opportunity this afternoon to condemn the terrorism that has been perpetrated by the PKK.

Thank you to Delyth Jewell for opening this debate, and I'm pleased that we are standing here having these international debates, because this is the place to have them. This is our national institution and we should make no apology for that. 

To start off with, I wanted to react quickly to something that Darren Millar said. The Belgian Supreme Court ruled earlier this month that there was no terror activity from the PKK and instead it was an organisation in conflict with Turkey over their treatment of the Kurds. Terror designation is often a political question, not a technical one. That's the ruling by the Supreme Court in Belgium, and I am really sorry that you've used this debate to try and dilute what we are here today to do—to talk about the human rights of political prisoners who have not had access to a solicitor to even try and make a point about their political—

I've supported the human rights of prisoners.

You took four minutes before you even mentioned Turkey—

Because I had a lot to get through.

—and about the terror that Turkey are imposing on the Kurdish community. 

I think the Plaid Cymru motion covers the key points relevant to this debate. I am a little confused by some of the Conservative amendments, which seem to puzzlingly refer only to the PKK, when this debate is focused on the general situation of the Kurds in Anatolia and northern Syria: a cynical—a cynical—attempt to try and dilute this particular debate here today. I've met Kurdish residents in Wales and their campaign group, which has absolutely no involvement with the PKK. Reading these Tory amendments, you could be forgiven for thinking that they are a deliberate attempt to muddy the water and excuse the treatment of the Kurds in Turkey, always through the lens of the PKK, an organisation, in practice, with a limited reach and operation.  

Let's also be clear that the Turkish Government consistently uses the threat of the PKK as a wider justification for the generally poor human rights conditions they maintain in southern and south-eastern Turkey. And I won't take any lessons from a party who said that Nelson Mandela was a terrorist. Let us look back in history and see what the Conservatives have done to treat people with a lack of respect in our international discourse. There are politicians that have been locked up—politicians like Leyla Güven, who are democratically elected—intimidated, harassed on their streets, communities that have suffered intimidation and a curtailment of their democratic rights. The Turks and others are now directly using military action in northern Syria under the pretext of combating terror, by attacking rebel groups that, up until relatively recently, had the support of the United States and others as partners in the war against Isis. So, I reject these Tory amendments, as do my colleagues, and I don't think they show an adequate appreciation of the wider context.

On a personal level, I see this as a basic fight for justice for a people who have been stateless throughout the vast majority of their history. Some Kurdish origin states were established, but were overran by Turkic states and confederations when they moved into the middle east in the middle ages. Kurds have been without a formally recognised state since that point in time. So, I would hope that Members recognise their struggle in that particular context, recognise the struggle and passions that this ignites, from a people just looking for a homeland, looking for somewhere to make their home, so that the people who have come to listen to this debate, many of whom are from that community, can thrive and can practice their own religion and language and culture, and seriously consider what it takes to drive people to hunger strike for such long periods of time. People are going to suffer, as happened in the north of Ireland. When people thought that the political process could not help them, they resorted to hunger strike because they wanted to be listened to, and they wanted to ensure that they could come to a solution.    

My heart goes out to Imam Sis and to all those who are on hunger strike. Clearly, it's a very difficult position for us to be in, because we don't want people to be in that type of situation, but we do commend them for doing that as an act of political protest and support them in their plight. I would hope that we would get a positive statement of support from the international Minister here today, and a recognition that she will do everything within her possibility to fight for justice for the Kurdish community, not only those who are in Turkey, but for people in Wales who are fighting from the sidelines, fighting here because they simply are not safe to return to their home country. So, I hope that you will all take part in this debate and support the Plaid Cymru motion.

I am glad to be able to participate in this important motion, and, just as we have previously discussed issues relating to Spain and Catalonia, as I have previously raised issues relating to Ukraine, just as we discuss issues around genocide in the Balkans, so it is right that we speak up today on behalf of our Kurdish community and the current situation in Kurdistan, in Kurdish communities, and in the context of human and national rights. I first became engaged with Kurdish activists back in 1976, when I became aware of the history of the struggle of the Kurdish people to protect their cultural and linguistic rights and their rightful demands for nationhood. Their history is one of death and torture, of exploitation, broken promises and betrayal by the world's powers—a trust that has been broken by the west time and time again as a consequence of geopolitical politics and vested interests, very similar to the geopolitics that I've spoken about in this Chamber affecting Ukraine to this day. So, it's one that I feel a great personal affinity with. 

As long ago as 1963, a Ukrainian dissident poet Vasyl Symonenko wrote a solidarity poem to highlight this common cause. It was titled 'Kurdskomy Bratovi', 'to a Kurdish Brother', and it was a poem that was rapidly banned by the then Soviet authorities. It read:

'Вони прийшли не тільки за добром / Прийшли забрати ім'я твоє, мову.' 

'Жиріє з крові змучених народів / Наш ворог найлютіший—шовінізм.'

'To steal your goods alone they did not come, / they came to take away your race and language.'

'And on the blood of tortured nations thriving, / grows fat our worst of foeman—chauvinism.'

'He acts with shame and with deceit, / his plan is to turn you all into a humble brood'.

Llywydd, this motion is not about the politics of Abdullah Öcalan or his political party. It is about the treatment of a political leader of many Kurds, arrested in February 1999, kept in solitary confinement, exposed—like many other Kurds—to trial recognised by the UN and human rights groups as unfair, and unsatisfactory treatment, as recognised by bodies such as Amnesty International, by the European Committee for the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment, and his treatment is symbolic of the treatment of the Kurdish people.

Llywydd, the plight of the Kurdish people is one we should be ashamed of, because over decades we have been—our Governments have been—complicit in turning a blind eye to the abuses of basic human and national rights, just as we have of the Palestinian people. It seems that we are forever to put our economic and vested interests ahead of the basic rights of the Kurdish people and the undemocratic and increasingly oppressive actions of the Turkish Government and also, indeed, the Syrian, Iraqi and Iranian Governments. It seems that yet again oil always speaks louder than human rights.

Since the coup in Turkey, 150,000 public officials have been dismissed, 64,000 jailed on so-called terrorism charges, and 150 journalists and nine parliamentarians imprisoned. Atrocities are being committed on a daily basis against the Kurdish people. If there is ever to be a just peace and resolution of the Kurdish question, then Turkey and other Governments must engage with the Kurdish people and their representatives. I, therefore, give my full support to this motion.

And, in respect of the Tory amendment, it is typical of the Tories that they choose to ignore human rights issues and become apologists for Turkish atrocities. I condemn all terrorism and human rights abuses and I note that this amendment—. This amendment is exactly the same tactic the Tories used to support apartheid South Africa—the same Tories who labelled Nelson Mandela a terrorist, who wore—[Interruption.]—the same Tories who wore 'hang Mandela' T-shirts, only to fawn over Nelson Mandela decades later, despite doing nothing to secure his release, and it is so disappointing that they repeat their historic mistakes and failings. 

I'm very pleased that Plaid Cymru's been able to secure this debate today. A Welsh citizen who has become a friend is on hunger strike in Newport, and I was reminded of Imam Sis's commitment to building strong and diverse communities when a Facebook memory photograph popped up just this week from two years ago, when Imam and I marched together in Cardiff against racism. He was prepared to stand up for our communities then and he has on many other occasions. Now, it's our turn to stand with him and his fellow Kurds and their struggle.

I first got into politics because I wanted to challenge inequity, inequality and injustice, and that is still a motivator for me more than two decades on, and while we have so many problems to deal with here in Wales—problems and issues that we raise in this institution day in and day out—we also have a duty to speak out when there is an international matter that requires our attention, especially when it affects a Welsh citizen.

The treatment of the Kurdish people at the hands of an increasingly despotic Turkish state is one such issue. The torture meted out to the Kurdish people demands that we speak out and condemn such action. Imam Sis is on day 94 of a hunger strike. He is one of more than 300 people who have joined Kurdish politician Leyla Güven on hunger strike. The strike is to put pressure on the European Committee for the Prevention of Torture and Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment to fulfil its duties and pay a visit to check on the situation of the Kurdish leader.

I saw Imam Sis just last week, and it's hard to see how much he has deteriorated since that photograph that was taken two years ago. It's impossible not to be inspired by the unassuming and unflinching bravery that he exudes. I only hope that Turkey, a country that is a signatory to the European Convention on Human Rights, fulfils its international obligations before good people like Imam Sis die.

If this national institution sends a clear message today that Turkey must cease its barbaric treatment of Kurdish people, we will contribute to increasing international pressure to resolve this situation. I have today received a response to a letter I sent to Kurdish MP Leyla Güven, who is also on hunger strike in Turkey. In that letter, she says 'our demand is completely legal and humane'. She says, 'We, the Kurds, are a people whose language, identity, culture are still criminalised. Thousands of our politicians are currently in prison for their thoughts. Our municipal buildings have been forcibly seized and are run by appointed trustees of the Government. We are a people subjected to all kinds of denial, annihilation and assimilation policies. To put an end to this lawlessness, our struggle continues.' Does anyone see any parallels here? Us Welsh should understand this. Time is fast running out for people like Leyla Güven and Imam Sis, so I urge you all to support us in this debate.

Mohammad Asghar.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. I'm just grateful to you for letting me speak for a couple of minutes. The fact is that I've been to Kurdistan myself. I stayed in Sulaymaniyah, I stayed in Duhok and I stayed in Diyarbakir. I've travelled through Kurdistan, which is divided into four parts, partly owned by Iranians, partly owned by Syrians, partly owned by Iraqis and partly owned by Turkish. At the moment, Abdullah Öcalan—[Interruption.] Just let me speak my few words, please. You must be aware of the background of Kurdistan first. They're all Muslim. I went there in one of my Kurdish friends' company and one of the restaurants would not serve me because they thought I was an Arab, and, once they were told I was British, then, actually, they looked after me very well—Kurdish fellow. I'm very, very friendly with Kurdish people, I went with them, and three times more, and I'm friendly with Turks also. Don't underestimate that they are altogether. They are living there for centuries.

Now, you're setting up a very different precedent here. If somebody comes from any part of the world and starts going on a hunger strike—'Do this in my country otherwise I'm going to die'—what message are you going to give to the world? There are many, many other parts of the world having the same sort—[Interruption.] Wait a minute. They're having the same problems and you're giving a route for this sort of thing—'Okay, come to this country; we'll try to help you'. That is actually a problem for those people to sort out their own problems with their own communities.

Please, yes, you wanted to ask something.

I just wanted to pick up on what you were saying about how part of the Kurdish community is owned by Iran and partly by—. It's not owned by them; it's occupied by them. And we have to realise that people don't go on hunger strike because they just want to bring attention to themselves. There has to be some really, really fierce commitment that will give them the strength to end their life, effectively, for the cause that they are endeavouring to achieve. I met Imam Sis last night, and I have to say that everything that has been said about him by other people is absolutely true. He is an extremely upright and admirable individual, and we simply have to be a little bit more reflective on why it is that people are so desperate to get their cause heard and their self-determination so that they're not continuing to be bombed and imprisoned for simply wanting to speak their own language and have their own self-administration.

Thank you for your little lesson, but the fact is what you just heard me saying; you're setting up a very different precedent. You're asking for the people. There's not one Öcalan here. You're not talking about one Abdullah Öcalan. There are a lot of other similar sorts of situations around the globe. Don't underestimate—. You are actually opening Pandora's—. You are opening Pandora's box—[Interruption.] No, no, no. Those countries must look after their own selves. And they're living very happily. Don't ever think the Turks and Kurdish are fighting every day. The great people are living together, and their Imam—. As he said, the Kurdish are a great nation. Iraqis, Iranians, Syrians—they are also the same. And they're living for centuries. They're not—. You just mentioned occupation; it's nonsense. There's no occupation. They were divided into groups, yes. If you go back 500 years—. Look, Jeremy Adams, on the Irish isle—20 years ago, he was a different person. Gerry Adams, sorry. He was a different person 30 years ago. Now, he's a totally different person. [Interruption.] Time and—. Wait a minute. Time and negotiation do happen, and they do change the nation. It will happen. It will happen with Turkey. [Interruption.] As long as Turkey and they sit—. It is their job. It's not our job. They will sit and sort their problem out, to make sure—. Do not open Pandora's box here. [Interruption.] Thank you, no—

The Minister for International Relations and the Welsh Language, Eluned Morgan.

Thank you very much. May I start by saying, as Minister for international affairs, that we as a Government take a great interest in safeguarding human rights across the globe, and that is why many of us became active in politics in the first place? We in Wales have a long tradition of standing shoulder to shoulder with political, progressive organisations throughout the world.

May I make it clear to begin with that the Welsh Government condemns persecution and violence in all their forms, anywhere in the world, and we support efforts to promote reconciliation where there is discord?

Now, turning to the motion before us today, I think it's important to recognise and celebrate the political, economic and cultural contribution made by people of Kurdish heritage to Welsh communities. When people who are born in other parts of the world come to Wales to make Wales their home, we are enriched as a nation. And when those who have adopted Wales as their country as a nation suffer, we suffer with them, and that's why we're extremely concerned about the worsening condition of Imam Sis from Newport. We absolutely recognise the strength of feeling that exists in Welsh communities on the issue we're debating today. He is, as we've heard, on hunger strike to draw attention and to seek improvements to the conditions under which the Kurdish leader Öcalan is being held in a Turkish prison.

Today, I've spoken to the Turkish ambassador of the United Kingdom, as I did in January, where I raised the concerns of Welsh citizens about the worsening condition of Imam Sis and the reasons for his ongoing hunger strike. The ambassador asserted that in March 2018, the European committee for the prevention of torture published a report that highlighted that the conditions under which Öcalan was being held had materially improved since their previous visit in 2013. He also suggested that Öcalan's brother had been to visit him in January this year, and as far as he knows—and I think it's probably worth checking this—Öcalan does have access to lawyers. It's worth noting, however, that the European report suggests that the authors had serious concerns regarding the prisoner's contact with the outside world, and that this has further deteriorated.

The situation of Kurdish communities in Turkey and the neighbouring countries is an extremely complex matter that has deep historical roots as well as having broader significance in the present-day politics of the region. Since the 1980s, there has been a series of unsuccessful attempts to bring about an end to the violence through peace talks, and during this time, more than 40,000 people have lost their lives. We can’t lose sight of this, and our thoughts go to the victims, their families, and the civilians caught up on both sides of the conflict.

Now, we expect the Turkish authorities to ensure that prisoners’ human rights are observed, including access to medical treatment. We support the UK Government’s stance of urging all sides to return to negotiations, and for the peace process to be resumed and to bring about reconciliation and a lasting peace.

The motion under consideration today invites the National Assembly to call on the Welsh Government to write to the European Council on its behalf. As this is the first debate of this nature since I’ve become Minister for international relations, I believe it’s important to emphasise and to underline the fact that foreign policy is an area of policy that is specifically reserved to the UK Government. Therefore, the power to produce such a statement rests with the UK Government. However much Plaid Cymru would like us to have this power, the fact is we do not have it.

The motion does seem somewhat unusual, in that the opposition debate today does not call on the Welsh Government to do anything in the areas in which we have responsibility and in which we have the resources available to take action.

Will you take an intervention?

I'm happy to do that.

Thank you for taking an intervention; it will be very brief. Do you not think it's perfectly relevant for Welsh Government to take an opinion on a matter that is not devolved?

I think, when it comes to reserved matters, we have to honour the agreement that we have, and this is an area that is specifically reserved. Foreign affairs is specifically reserved. That’s why, as the Welsh Government, we are treating this motion as we would a backbench Members' debate, and we are granting a free vote to Labour Members.

Now, I’d like to encourage Members in future to ensure that, where we engage with international issues, we keep the focus clearly on those areas in which we can take action and make a real difference. Now, we as a Government will abstain on this motion, but there is nothing to prevent the National Assembly from writing on its own behalf to the European Council.

Delyth Jewell to reply to the debate.

Thank you to everyone who's taken part in this debate. Members have spoken very movingly in favour of the motion. I agree with Bethan that it’s only right that this Chamber should express our voice on international issues, particularly when they concern a Welsh citizen. Mick Antoniw spoke of the personal affinity that he feels with the Kurds, and I thank him for his very moving words. And Leanne spoke of her personal friendship with Imam. I, too, am proud to call Imam a friend. I agree that it’s impossible not to be inspired by him. Thank you to Jenny Rathbone as well for her support on this.

I was glad to hear the Minister saying that we in Wales have a tradition of calling out injustice internationally, and I will quote her words: when people from other parts of the world come to Wales to make their home, we are enriched, and when they suffer, we suffer, too.

I’m glad that she has raised this issue with the Turkish ambassador. I would still implore the Government to please support our motion. We can still write a letter on this. Again, when the Government have created a ministry for international affairs, surely it is within the bounds of that to express an opinion on this.

I’m afraid that I found some of Darren Millar’s comments—and I’ll use his word—‘distasteful’. I regret the tone of his contribution profoundly. I won’t get into what Darren has said, but I’ll repeat that the motion is about human rights and ending the enforced solitary confinement of a political prisoner. And the life of a Welsh citizen—Imam is 32; he’s a year older than me, and he might die.

Will you take an intervention?

You didn't take an intervention from me, Darren. I'm not going to take one from you.

Llywydd, I wish to end the debate by explaining that Imam and the others on this strike are motivated in their actions by their desire to give Mr Öcalan a voice that has been denied him. To do that, they are willing to sacrifice their lives—not that they want to. A few weeks ago, I visited Imam in the Kurdish community centre in Newport. He's now living in that centre as he's too unwell to go elsewhere.

I'd been anticipating the visit with a sense of foreboding. I thought it was going to be quite traumatic, but in reality it was life-affirming. Imam told me he's not on hunger strike because he wants to die. It's because he wants to celebrate life. At first, that might seem like a contradiction, but actually it's in keeping with this phenomenon that many sub-state nations experience—that of asserting a positive in the face of a challenging negative. That's something that small nations with more powerful neighbours, like the Kurds, like the Welsh, will have an affinity with, and in that light, Imam's resolution, though drastic, though concerning, is actually not paradoxical at all.

The Kurdish centre in Newport where Imam is living was established with the aid of my predecessor, Steffan Lewis, and I know that this is something he would have supported wholeheartedly. Imam, too, is caring, thoughtful; he is an honourable man whose only concern is seeking justice for his brothers and sisters in their Kurdish homelands. I'm deeply concerned about his welfare, and I fear the worst may come to pass unless his reasonable demand for Mr Öcalan to be treated humanely is met, and I therefore implore my fellow Members to support our motion today, and Imam, we send our best wishes to you. Diolch.

The proposal is to agree the motion without amendment. Does any Member object? [Objection.] I will defer voting under this item until voting time.

Voting deferred until voting time.