Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:04 pm on 11 June 2019.
I thank the Member for those questions. I can give him a categorical response to his first question: that I will continue to and the Welsh Government will continue to press this case with UK Government. He's right to say that, in the publication of the White Paper, they have not listened to the position we were advocating—indeed, in relation to salary levels, but also in relation to that 12-month temporary workers scheme and the very idea of having an EEA and non-EEA integrated scheme, which obviously goes to the heart of—. We have always advocated a differentiated scheme, which enables a closer alignment with our partners in the European Union.
On the point that he makes—and I should have acknowledged this in Delyth Jewell's question as well—about this question of a kind of spatial dimension, if you like, a Wales-specific dimension, we would prefer to see a scheme that reflects the needs of the UK economy at large, recognising how integrated in particular the Wales economy is in parts of the English economy specifically. But I should be absolutely clear; if we do not end up with a scheme like that, we will be pressing for a spatial dimension in recognition of arrangements that work for Wales. But the truth of the matter is, for example on the question of the salary level, actually, £30,000 doesn't work for really any part of the UK apart from the the south-east of England. So, actually, we have much more in common with other parts of the UK apart from the south-east of England.
On that second question that he raised, about the inter-governmental relations and what this tells us about that, I think it does tell us something quite important about that, which is to say the world in which we can simply regard things as reserved or devolved is being left behind by Brexit. What is increasingly clear is that in a number of these areas we have common interests regardless of whether the constitutional settlement tells us that a matter is reserved or devolved. So, migration cuts right through that, doesn't it, as we've been discussing today. The delivery of the health service, the delivery of social care, the delivery of higher education depends, to a significant extent, on the migration policy. So, it's not possible, in a sense, to divorce those two questions, and I think that goes to the heart of how we need to take forward the discussions we're having in relation to the inter-governmental review, for example, one that recognises that whereas we might not expect, within the constitutional realities that we face, that we have a veto over those issues, that we should always be seeking, as four parts of the United Kingdom—we should always be seeking, at least, a shared understanding of how these policies should operate in all four parts of the UK. That has not been the case to date in relation to migration, but we will continue to press the case clearly and hard on behalf of Wales.