6. Will the Minister make a statement on the weight given to environmental considerations in the planning system? OAQ54075

Sustainable development is at the heart of the planning system. 'Planning Policy Wales' is clear that environmental issues have parity with social, economic and cultural considerations and, together with technical advice and supporting guidance, provides comprehensive coverage on environmental considerations in the planning system. 

Thank you for that response, because that’s the theory, but I think the practice is slightly different, because as the First Minister made clear in relation to his decision on the M4 that the weighting that he has given to environmental considerations is different to the weighting given to those considerations by the Planning Inspectorate, I think that does highlight an inconsistency, and an important inconsistency, within the system. One does question how many other decisions would have been different if the Planning Inspectorate had given the same weighting to environmental considerations as the First Minister and the Government clearly do now. So, how do you intend to amend or correct the incorrect perception of the Planning Inspectorate of the weighting that should be given to environmental considerations, particularly given the declaration of a climate emergency?

I take the point the Member's trying to make, but I think it's not entirely a fair one. Obviously, when any individual human being brings a judgment to bear on a set of facts, there's an element of subjectivity in that, no matter how objective the rules are that are set out. And one individual gives slightly different weight to something than another for a variety of reasons. But what we try to do in Wales—and we're about to go out to consultation on the national development framework and, as I said yesterday in my submission about regional working for local authorities, we're putting a strategic planning tier in as well—here in Wales we want to have a plan-led system where local people have a big say in what their local plan says, that we assist them to have that very loud say in what their local plan says—every area should look the way its local people want it to look; that's the point of the planning system—but that there are a set of rules that we agree here in the Assembly and in our various tiers of government that are applied to make sure that people have the right considerations in place. So, this is a set of rules that says that environmental considerations have the same weight as the economic, social and other considerations. That is the weight we expect the inspectorate to put on it, and I just recently spoke to the royal institute of town planners and I made very clear what our expectations were for the places of the future and I made it extremely clear that what we want to see are local, sustainable communities with a sense of place, which value their local environment and their local culture and their local economic arrangements, which have sustainable jobs closer to where they live, in a system that allows us to make the best use of Wales's natural resources—so, very much what you said. But what we're doing is putting the plan-led system in place that would allow that to happen.

Now, ideally, you would have put the national development framework in first, but we are where we are. So, we've got a set of LDPs that are going through review at the moment. We will put the national development framework in place in consultation with the people of Wales over the summer and then we will put the strategic bits in place, and, at each one of those, there will be a loud conversation with the people of Wales to make sure that we have that balance right for them, because people in different places put different emphasis on different types of things, depending on local need.

So, I'm sort of agreeing with you, I think, but the element of subjectivity is necessarily there. So, in the end, the decision maker brings that to bear, but they do it in a way that is compliant with the system that's in place and unchallengeable in the sense that they show that they've put that balance right. But there'll always be nuance in that. So, the individual decision maker will always bring that nuance to it. And that's the case for planning committees and for planning inspectors. We would like to see as many decisions as possible made in the planning committees themselves, in the democratically controlled councils that are elected to do these things, and, if we can get that system right, we will see a diminution of the appeals to the Planning Inspectorate and—Llywydd, if you'll forgive me for going on at length about this, but I think it's an important point—we are also, of course, consulting about separating the planning inspectorate for Wales into a separate body for that exact reason, because we want a planning system in Wales that's fit for Wales's future.

I'm struggling to think of anything that the Minister could possibly add to that in a supplementary question. [Laughter.] If I could just ask—. You mentioned in the middle of your speech there, Minister, the need to build houses for the future. I've had correspondence with one of my constituents—. I don't want to go into the individual planning applications, but the local authority has turned down a modern eco house—or is in the process of doing that—on the basis that the land within which it's being built also contains a derelict building that they say should be done up first. My constituents have raised a valid point, which is, surely, now that we've got the climate change emergency and we're talking about environmental concerns—is there a need to overhaul planning guidance to local authorities so that the climate emergency and the need for environmental concerns are factored into it at a far greater level, so that, if someone does want to build an eco-friendly house, then surely that should be pushed a little bit higher up the agenda so that we are getting homes that are more helping with the decarbonising agenda?

Well, I'm not going to comment on the individual planning application, about which I know nothing, and so I'm going to make my remarks much more general. But we changed—. Actually, my colleague Lesley Griffiths, one of the last thing she did as the planning Minister was to issue the new 'Planning Policy Wales' document, which fundamentally changes the planning system in Wales, which, I think—. People are talking about a review; we've just fundamentally changed the system, and, if you haven't read it, I recommend it to you. It is not a dry planning document. It's a very living document, which fundamentally shifts the landscape in Wales that we're talking about, and it does it in the way that you've just outlined. So, it talks about the sustainability of placemaking, it talks about using local resources in the best way, it talks about the development of proper planning processes with local people at the heart of it.

And, as I've just said, we're also putting the rest of that framework into place now. We will shortly be consulting over the summer on the national development framework. I encourage all Assembly Members to engage with that and come back to us with both their own and their constituents' comments on that plan. And, as I said yesterday, I've started to outline a process by which we want local authorities to put the strategic layer of plans in place. People have to be at the heart of that process, because it's their place that they're making and what we want to ensure is that the citizens of Wales feel that their planning system properly represents them. The individual decisions are then made in the light of the weight of the documents that their locality has put in place. So, if you don't engage with your local development plan process, you will not have a say in what those rules are when they come to each individual planning application. So, we need to strengthen that voice because I think often it's the case that a local community only realises when an individual planning application comes forward that there's an issue and they don't engage with the plan part of that process in quite the way we'd like. So, I very much welcome views on how we might get a better engagement so that people own their plan in a much more realistic way.

Not only for humans but for animals as well, please. Apart from acting as boundaries and keeping animals inside fields, the hedgerow is an important habitat for a wide variety of animals and plants. As woodlands have been destroyed over the years, a lot of wildlife in them has adapted to living underneath hedgerows and in hedgerows. Will the Minister ensure that, for planning rules, they give due regard to the protection of both the urban and the rural wildlife by conserving and creating the habitats that sustain these creatures?

Yes. I think that's a very valid point, and, as each local development plan goes through, those are the sorts of considerations that the planners and the councillors in each local area should be giving to the preservation of their local landscape. My colleague the Minister for environment has recently been consulting widely on the protection of countryside—things such as hedgerows—and we will certainly be taking that into account.