Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 3:36 pm on 15 October 2019.
Can I thank the First Minister for his statement this afternoon? Britain is now in an unprecedented constitutional process, and the UK's withdrawal from the European Union will change the relationship between the constituent parts of the United Kingdom. As Britain moves further along this process, the inter-governmental relations between each part of the UK are profoundly critical in providing constitutional stability to the union. It is clear that the Welsh Government's 'Reforming our Union' report calls for a root-and-branch reform of the existing inter-governmental mechanisms, including memoranda of understanding, to meet the new challenges of a post-Brexit world. Therefore, my first question to the First Minister is to ask what immediate inter-governmental talks have taken place between himself and his counterparts across the UK on this specific issue, because effective inter-governmental relations are essential in order to achieve a smooth transfer of competencies from the European Union to the devolved administrations.
Today's statement on the Welsh Government's 'Reforming our Union' report rightly acknowledges that the principles underpinning devolution should be recognised as fundamental to the UK constitution. The UK Government currently has unlimited legislative competence across the UK, and I think there's weight to the argument that a new settlement could be introduced to ensure that future UK Governments do not legislate on matters within devolved competence. In outlining this cause, the First Minister has reiterated the concept of subsidiarity, acknowledging popular sovereignty in each part of the UK, and that concept was also favoured by the House of Lords' Constitution Committee in its inquiry into the union and devolution. However, that report also concluded that powers should only be devolved to a particular nation when doing so would benefit the people of that nation, and without detriment to the union as a whole. Therefore, in light of this, can the First Minister tell us his views on how the subsidiarity principle can be tested effectively when seeking to devolve further powers, so that future Welsh Governments, of any colour, can't simply seek the devolution of powers on whatever they want, based on their own political will?
There are also concerns over the development of common frameworks for when Britain leaves the European Union. There is still a wealth of discussions to be had over the nature of some of those frameworks—for example, whether they'll take shape in the form of legislation or perhaps by memorandum of understanding. Perhaps in his response the First Minister could take the opportunity to update Members on where we are in relation to the development of common frameworks.
Of course, no discussion on constitutional reform is complete without considering the fiscal responsibilities of devolved legislatures. Today's statement confirms that fiscal responsibility has become an increasingly important part of recent changes to the devolution settlements across the UK. And we, on this side of the Chamber, have long called for financial reform that would see the balance of power and resources more fairly shared across Britain. And so, I'm pleased that the Welsh Government is advocating the replacement of the Barnett formula with a needs-based system. The First Minister makes it clear that he believes the legitimacy of a UK fiscal framework can only be properly secured if it is jointly agreed and independently operated and assured. And perhaps the First Minister could provide some more specific information about this proposition.
At the crux of any constitutional reform must be a commitment from all legislatures, across the UK, to respect the devolution settlement. I agree with the First Minister that the relationship between the four Governments of the UK should be based on mutual respect, and I can certainly see the merit of a constitutional convention as a vehicle for bringing forward future constitutional developments. Of course, Wales must have a seat at the table when it comes to developing new constitutional policy, but we must be careful that any new constitutional set-up doesn't compromise the devolution settlement, and, indeed, the union of the United Kingdom. Therefore, can the First Minister tell us how he envisages this new convention operating? And how confident is he that the devolution settlement can be safeguarded by this new constitutional vehicle?
As Britain's constitutional future begins to change in the wake of withdrawing from the European Union, it's more crucial than ever that the people of the UK are engaged fully in a debate about the structure of the UK. I think it's fair to say that, on the whole, people are more concerned with the quality of their public services and the accountability of their governments, and so we, as representatives, must do more to engage with the people of Wales on its future. The First Minister talks about the voice of the citizen being involved in this process, and so perhaps he could tell us a bit more about the Welsh Government's consultation and engagement plans with the people of Wales on how they want to see our country's constitutional position in the future.
So, with that, Llywydd, we, on this side of the Chamber, share the First Minister's commitment to see Wales thrive in a strong United Kingdom, and I look forward to working constructively with the Welsh Government and Governments right across the UK to respect the devolution settlement and protect the union of the United Kingdom for the future.