Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:13 pm on 23 February 2021.
The Minister referenced more consensus in Wales on higher education. I think there probably is something to be said for that. I'm not sure that she's yet entirely got me with the programme on progressive universalism, but I criticised the Diamond report initially for proposing maintenance grants for families with up to £80,000 a year income, which I thought was way too high, but the Minister brought that down, I think, to nearer £50,000. And I agree with much of what she said just now, and I certainly much prefer it to the Plaid spokesperson's approach and demand for leadership for staying in Wales in the first place. I agree with the Minister that it's in no way unpatriotic to decide to go to university outside Wales. I recall the absurd situation where the previous First Minister, I think, attacked Adam Price for having taken up the opportunity to study at Harvard. I think we should all have those opportunities to benefit from study elsewhere.
And where I really agree with what the Minister has said is that student support should be portable across the United Kingdom. I'd just like to say how different the Welsh Government's approach has been from that of the Scottish Government. There was a very interesting article in The Economist last week that referred to the Scottish Government education policy weakening the bonds that unite the kingdom. The Economist suggested that it was the intention of the SNP to do this, to stop people when they're young leaving Scotland and potentially going to England and some perhaps staying there, and to ensure that they stayed in Scotland and therefore were more likely to support the SNP. They get free education at university if they stay in Scotland but have to pay £9,250 a year if they go to England, so it's no surprise that many more stay in Scotland. What that's seen is mobility from Scotland fall very significantly. In Wales, I think 2 per cent of people each year go to another nation or English region, compared to Scotland, where only 0.5 per cent do so, and that's a massive difference. It's really increased, and that, at least in part, I believe, is due to the student finance system. So, I'd like to thank and applaud the Minister for what she's done on this area, even to the extent of giving higher maintenance and support if a student studies in London, because of the higher cost. I think there's a huge difference between what she and the Welsh Government have done compared to what the SNP and Scotland have done and, perhaps, what Plaid might like to happen here. So, well done on that.
Can I also just briefly ask her about COVID? Firstly, is there any chance that students might get some sort of refund for the terrible situations that so many have had over the past year and that still continue in terms of the value they've got? What are her views on that? Second, I recall, about a year ago, the UK Government put in caps—at least in England—to try and protect some of the lower-ranking institutions from seeing lots more students go to the higher-ranking institutions just for that year or two because of the COVID impact and because of not having international students. I think the Minister quite rightly complained about that unilateral action taken by the UK Government that affected Wales and how it would be much better if that had been done on a co-ordinated UK basis. Could she update us as to what's now happening on that issue?