Item 8: The Health Protection (Coronavirus Restrictions) (No. 5) (Wales) (Amendment) (No. 13) Regulations 2021. I call on the Minister for Health and Social Services to move the motion. Eluned Morgan.

Motion NDM7724 Lesley Griffiths

To propose that the Senedd, in accordance with Standing Order 27.5:

1. Approves The Health Protection (Coronavirus Restrictions) (No. 5) (Wales) (Amendment) (No. 13) Regulations 2021 laid in the Table Office on 18 June 2021.

Motion moved.

Thank you very much, Deputy Presiding Officer. I move the motion before us today.

The Health Protection (Coronavirus Restrictions) (No. 5) (Wales) Regulations 2020 set out the legislative framework for the four alert levels described in the coronavirus management plan. Since February, and until recently, we have seen improvements in the situation in Wales. The number of cases of coronavirus and the number who are hospitalised as a result of the virus had been falling. This has enabled us to make substantial changes to the restrictions, allowing people to enjoy more freedoms with every review held. As the regulations note, the restrictions do have to be reviewed on a three-weekly basis. In the review on 4 June, because of initial concerns about the spread of the delta variant, a decision was taken that the decision to move to alert level 1 would be made in a phased manner. We said that we would review the situation within that same review period, and an additional review was held a fortnight later.

I want to apologise if this contribution sounds very similar to the debate that we had last week. Last week, I did provide an update on the announcement made by the First Minister. But, today, there is an opportunity for us to formally agree the changes to those regulations, in a formal manner whereby the Senedd gives them its stamp of approval. As the First Minister announced on 18 June, repeating the message in his press conference of last Friday, we have agreed to pause any major relaxations until the review on 15 July. The reason for this is the increase in coronavirus cases the length and breadth of Wales, and the ongoing uncertainty about the delta variant. Similar action plans have been adopted across the UK.  

As the First Minister announced on 18 June, and reiterated in his press conference last Friday, we have agreed to pause any major relaxations until the 15 July review. This is a result of the increase in coronavirus cases across the whole of Wales, and continued uncertainty about the delta variant. Similar approaches have been adopted across the United Kingdom. This delay is important for two reasons. First, it will allow us to vaccinate more people. We will focus on second doses, which we know provide a high degree of protection against the delta variant. Secondly, it will give us more time to understand the impact of vaccination on the link between cases, hospital admissions and deaths.

While we have decided to delay the full move to alert level 1 until at least 15 July, we have made some minor adjustments to the regulations to make them easier to apply and to understand. The No. 13 amendment to the regulations before us today permits the number of people allowed to gather at a wedding or civil partnership reception or a wake to be decided according to the size of the venue. The maximum number of people attending will be determined by a risk assessment. We recognise that these are really significant moments in people's lives, and we've tried to prioritise them during the pandemic where we can. We have also clarified in the regulations that small grass-roots entertainment—such as music and comedy—venues can operate in alert level 2 or lower. This will bring them into line with the wider hospitality sector.

To do this, we have included an exception to the events restrictions, which could otherwise prevent them from opening with more than 30 people present. We have clarified our rules on the measures that must be put in place by a person responsible for a regulated premises, like a restaurant or a pub. In particular, we have clarified that a person responsible for a premises does not need to ensure 2m distancing within a group of six people. This will apply in premises outdoors or indoors and in places such as on a train or at events. We still advise people to practise social distancing where possible and refrain from hand shaking and hugging. Regulated premises will also be responsible for undertaking a risk assessment and putting into place any measures identified to minimise the chances of exposure to coronavirus at these premises. The same regulation on the measures businesses are expected to take has been redrafted to reflect the latest evidence on managing risks. This includes considering ventilation as an important mitigation. We’ve published refreshed statutory guidance to provide further explanation of these changes.

And finally, primary school children will be allowed to stay overnight in residential outdoor education centres—a crucial part of their education experience. This is going to be a phased approach but, from 21 June, children in their school contact groups or class bubbles will be allowed to stay overnight at these centres. It is important we remove restrictions as soon as they aren't proportionate, given the significant social and economic impact they have on people and businesses in Wales, and for that reason I urge Members to support these amendments. Diolch, Llywydd.

The Llywydd took the Chair.

Thank you, Minister, for the regulations today and bringing them forward. I can certainly say that, as Welsh Conservatives, we’ll be supporting the regulations today that have been brought forward in retrospect, because clearly they are relaxing a number of restrictions, including, as you mentioned, weddings and funerals, which, as you said, are important life moments for families. I agree with all your sentiments on that. I’m very pleased to see those in these current regulations.

I’m also very pleased—I know we’ve spoken about it previously—about outdoor educational centres and overnight stays. That’s very much welcome. The concern I have—and I hope this will be taken as perhaps a lesson to be learnt—is the lead time of these announcements, because many businesses need time to change their arrangements, and schools are already making arrangements in advance for obvious reasons. So, if there’s a short lead time, then there just won’t be time before the end of the school term in order to make use of that particular regulation. I am concerned that some schools, perhaps from England, who usually come to Wales, will go to England this year, and then they'll keep going back to England rather than coming back to Wales.

I note the amendment to regulation 16 of the principal regulations, and I see that there’s clarification there on risk assessments made by persons responsible for regulated premises, including the 2m social distancing rule. I very much welcome that particular amendment. I think that’s good and correct. I also note that premises, under the new requirement, must ensure that they have well-ventilated areas. I’d be grateful, perhaps in your summing up, if you’ve got any further details in that regard. I’m particularly thinking of business where, perhaps, due to the building structure, it’s very difficult to make changes, and if there’s any business support available to help those particular businesses. I’m sure it's not just applicable to businesses, but other public areas as well.

I’d also be grateful if you could explain your Government’s policy on the mitigation of COVID spread in schools, colleges and universities. Yesterday, I know that your colleague the Minister for education said that it will soon be up to individual premises to decide their own COVID safety rules in the future, and there will be no class bubbles or a requirement for schools to identify close contacts themselves. I know from reports yesterday that some of the unions have outlined that this policy would be impractical from their position, and that the decisions on COVID safety such as these should be decided by clinicians rather than teachers. That was the unions' view yesterday. So, I’d welcome your views and thoughts on that, in terms of do you agree with the union stance on that, or do you, of course, agree with your colleague the education Minister.

Speaking of getting back to some normality again, I can see that the UK Government has recommitted again its date of 19 July. The Scottish Government has pretty much done the same for 19 July as well, and is talking about going to level 0. I know that we've had long discussions on this in this Chamber, about having a date in stone like that. We're seeing now more infections in Wales, of course, but we're now at a point where we've seen zero COVID deaths reported by the Office for National Statistics for the first week since the pandemic. This has of course got to be extremely positive news for us to have that statistic. Also, general and acute beds occupied by COVID patients are now at their lowest level since the pandemic began all those months ago. So, I'm asking, I suppose, the questions in that regard.

Public Health Wales has recently produced figures for the delta variant, which show 117 deaths from 92,000 delta variant cases. I've got a whole range of stats here, which I won't go through, but, basically, the stats are outlining that if you've had those two vaccinations, then it's going to be extremely unlikely that you're going to be hospitalised. So, I know I'm going to sound like a bit of a broken record here, Minister, but, we're very much looking for that date. We know now—good news again—that 89 per cent of those over 18 have had their first vaccination in Wales. That's good, positive news. So, in that regard, with all this information coming together, I'm very much hoping that you'll be able to give us now some indication of when we will have that date in terms of lifting those restrictions and getting back to some degree of normality. I'm hoping that, one week when I ask that question, you will be able to give us that date.

Minister, it's not just, of course, normality for businesses as well, and education, which matters, but it's also bringing the NHS back to capacity through routine treatment and enabling it to cope with the huge backlog that we're facing in Wales. I have no doubt we'll be continuing to ask these questions throughout the course of the NHS's recovery from COVID-19. But I understand that NHS England has been steadily increasing its capacity to reduce the backlogs there, and will be working towards 115 per cent capacity during the medium term, to manage their waiting lists. It has further been able to establish COVID-lite sites across health boards over the last year, starting with cancer hubs. So, can I ask you about capacity here in Wales? Are there any capacity percentage targets that you will be working towards in that regard? What are we likely to see over this Senedd term? I also note that you've outlined, previously, your concerns about the 30,000 fewer cancer inquiries that the Welsh NHS has had—[Interruption.]—so far this year. I agree, of course—

Come on, Russ. 

—with that as well. Have I gone on too long, Presiding Officer? I will come to an end there, because the new Presiding Officer in the corner there has told me that I must be going over time. I will end there, then, stand-in Presiding Officer in the corner, and ask about local health boards' plans in terms of COVID-lite hubs and routine treatment in that regard as well.

Thank you very much, Russell George. Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Eluned Morgan rose—

Does the Minister want to reply?

This is a debate, not a statement. I've been told off on my timekeeping already; I won't be told off on my understanding of Standing Orders on debates. Rhun ap Iorwerth, if you wish to contribute, then start now, I suggest.

It was more seeking clarification than telling you off.

Don't be clever now, Mr ap Iorwerth.

Thank you, Minister, for that statement with regard to these new regulations. We'll be supporting these regulations, although the context of the regulations is a decision not to relax restrictions further. There was an opportunity here to look at a few elements and to push the boundaries of what was possible in terms of weddings and so on, and I certainly welcome that as a principle—that we should be seeking what is possible to do safely all the time. So, I do welcome that.

I just have four or five questions briefly. You mention again the importance of fresh air and ventilation—I welcome that very much. What about raising the spec of masks that we expect health and care workers to wear? There is still pressure on the Government to demand FFP3 masks—we would welcome clarity on that. And I would welcome clarity on what you said a week ago:

'In terms of students, it's clear that it is possible for people to walk in and receive their vaccine. It's important that people understand that, be it the first or second dose.'

Now, our research suggests that there are only two health boards, Hywel Dda and Betsi Cadwaladr, that are offering those walk-ins—those walk-in centres—without an appointment. Perhaps you can explain what the situation is, and if the walk-ins aren't available in every health board area, is it something that the Government is pressing, because I think it does need to be rolled out as part of the offer to bring more people in as soon as possible to have the vaccination.

I'll note here a major discontent in the world of education following the announcement of the education Minister yesterday. As the health Minister, where the understanding of rules and consistency of how rules are implemented across Wales are important in the battle against the virus, would you call upon the education Minister to look again at a few elements of what he said in terms of placing powers in the hands of individual schools and the confusion that that could cause?

And I also have a question about the new health Minister in Westminster. Has there been a meeting between you, or are you going to be seeking to meet the new health Minister, specifically to ask about his intention to press ahead, it appears, with that date to lift every restriction on 19 July in England, and to consider the implications of that for Wales, and the discussion that will be needed between you as health Ministers in that regard?

And finally, the Welsh language—the new app that will enable people to show a certificate that they have been vaccinated. We heard the First Minister say that it isn't available in Welsh. On every occasion, whatever the context, we should ensure that provision is available in Welsh and English at the same time. That is one question, but may I also draw your attention to the upset that has been caused? A number of people have contacted me seeing their vaccination cards with the Welsh language being crossed out—being filled in in English, which is fine if the staff aren't able to speak Welsh, but the Welsh is then crossed out. Having a vaccination is something that's become quite an emotional event for some people, and seeing the Welsh language being treated in that way has caused a great deal of upset for several people who have contacted me.

Thank you, Minister, for your statement this afternoon. I'd like to take the opportunity to speak on what has been described by some operators as the 'forgotten sector', that being Wales's residential outdoor education centres. The industry is worth roughly £40 million to the economy, with more than 1,700 people employed. Pre-COVID, there were 44 centres in Wales, and figures in March showed that at least five have closed over the last 12 months.

In my constituency of Carmarthen West and South Pembrokeshire, I have Morfa Bay Adventure, who I visited at the end of last month. They showed real concerns over the fact that the reopening of the sector here in Wales did not mirror that of the rest of the UK, putting their businesses at a legitimate disadvantage, as my colleague Russell mentioned earlier. In an e-mail following my visit to Morfa Bay, they wrote:

'I spoke to a school in Swindon yesterday due to visit in two weeks. They are praying they can visit, for their children, it will be their only holiday, probably, until they are old enough to leave home as adults. Some have never seen the sea or walked on the sand, and yet the Welsh Government continues to deny these children this opportunity.'

This shows the importance of these facilities and these locations to children's education, because what we learn in life is more than just what's taught to us in a classroom. I raised this issue with the education Minister following my visit, and was told that these businesses would not reopen until Wales moves fully to alert level 1. The last COVID regulation review saw Wales move not fully to alert level 1, but a bit-part move, with relaxations over certain areas. Consequently, outdoor education was not part of this review, and their continued closure at this time saw them disadvantaged still against their English counterparts. These Welsh businesses lost visits and may never claw them back, as schools decided to take their pupils to English outdoor education centres. This was despite Welsh schools being open, despite these businesses putting in safety measures to aid social distancing and allow bubbling of school groups, and despite the science and data showing the risk for our young people is incredibly low. It felt, said these businesses, that common sense was missing when the Welsh Government brought forward these COVID regulations.

While the Welsh Government provided clarification a full fortnight after the initial move to level 1 that allowed primary schools to visit these residential outdoor centres on the twenty-first of this month, this decision has been called woolly and seemingly out of sync with the rest of the UK by the industry. While it may be easy to think that these issues for this sector are now resolved, as they've been able to reopen to primary schools, that really is not the case.

Minister, I urge you, please, to work further to clarify the rules for these businesses to bring them in sync with other businesses across the UK so they are no longer disadvantaged, and also, as these businesses have been shut for longer than their English counterparts, that you work with your Cabinet colleagues to ensure that they are properly financially supported. Diolch.

As you will be aware, Ice Arena Wales is the only ice arena in the UK that remains closed. The arena, which is only a stone’s throw from this Senedd, has been closed for 15 months. Now, the hope was that this would have changed on 21 June, but a further delay was decided upon.

Ice Arena Wales is the most modern ice arena in the United Kingdom. It has a building management system to control fresh air flow and heating to create whatever conditions are considered safe. Not many indoor venues have such systems. On top of this, the ice arena has a ceiling and air volume far higher than other indoor venues that have already reopened, such as cinemas, bowling alleys and so on.

May I ask that this issue be considered as a matter of urgency, as it is having a detrimental effect on everyone connected to the arena? It appears to be counterintuitive that skaters can travel to England to train in less modern facilities, yet they cannot use the facility that we have here in Wales. Thank you.

The Minister to respond to the debate.

Diolch yn fawr. There were quite a few issues there. I'll just try and canter through them as quickly as I can. First of all, on weddings, we've always been really concerned about weddings. I know there are a lot of people who run businesses in this sector who have genuinely suffered during this time. We're also very aware that this is exactly the kind of place where the virus could spread, where people haven't seen each other for a very long time, so we have to bear that in mind, and that's why we've had to take a very careful approach to reopening weddings. But we're really pleased that we've been able to move a little bit quicker in that space with these particular amendments.

In terms of the lead time, in an ideal world, it is a problem, isn't it? You can't just snap up a wedding overnight. People need a longer lead-in time in order to organise, and the problem we have is that we have a three-weekly review. What we haven't done in Wales is to give a long-term commitment of what's likely to happen, and that's because we've watched what's happened in England, where they've made promises and they've been broken time and time again, as the virus has just reacted and responded in a different way from what was modelled. So, we have to be aware that things can change quickly, and we are taking a much more cautious approach, because we don't want to raise expectations that then need to be dashed, which is what's happened time and time again in England.

Ventilation—we're very keen to underline the importance of that; I am glad that Rhun has underlined that. I think, in particular, in summer, it is a good time to remind people that, actually, air flow is an important factor.

In terms of the spread in schools, I think what the education Minister has said is that there will be a framework within which people will make these decisions. It is not up to every school just to randomly decide what is going to happen; there will be a framework within which they will be working and that will be developed over the next few weeks so that we're ready for coming back to schools in September with an understanding of what those different circumstances may be, because we may have some parts of the country where the virus is running rampant, and other parts where the virus is at a low level.

We don't have a terminus date in Wales. We're not going to give a terminus date in Wales. And I just thought it was really interesting that the first thing that the new health Secretary did in England was to announce, 'Right, there we are, liberation day is coming.' And I have actually written to him, I'm pleased to say, just to welcome him to his post but also to say how important it is to follow the data. And that is the approach that we've taken in Wales. We usually have weekly meetings of the four nations' health Ministers. I haven't heard that it's going to be cancelled, so I'm assuming that that will go ahead. 

I am really pleased to see the very welcome figures that we're seeing in Wales in relation to the number of people in hospital now with COVID. We're down to 88 people in hospital with COVID. That's 21 per cent lower than last Tuesday. So, the signs are really looking very good, and so—. It's actually quite a difficult message, isn't it, to give to the public, to say, 'Actually, the case rates are going up, but it's levelling off in terms of hospital admissions.' So, we have to think about how we're going to deal with that in the next few weeks, and of course we'll have an opportunity to get a bit more data so that we can be absolutely clear about the situation. But it's looking very positive, I must say. 

And in terms of getting the NHS back to capacity, there's a real focus on this now. It's very difficult, because the rates are increasing significantly, and there will be people who work in our NHS who will catch COVID in the community and then they will have to self-isolate. So, we've got to remember that seeing those numbers increase in the community will also have an impact in our hospitals on the people who are working there. 

On the issue of walk-ins, particularly for students, I know that that's certainly possible in Cardiff, so it would be interesting—. I am willing to go away and ensure that the guidance is clear on that, but that's my understanding and I will pursue that issue and ensure that everyone is aware of that. 

In terms of the Welsh language certification, of course we're very disappointed that we can't have that at the moment. It's not our system. We've made it clear to the UK Government from the outset that we need to have this available in Welsh, too. The system does take time. Scotland and Northern Ireland don't have this as part of their system at all. They are still weeks away from that point. I'm very sorry to hear about the Welsh language being crossed out, and I will certainly look into that and find out exactly what's happening there, but I'm certain that isn't part of Government guidance. 

In terms of reopening outdoor residential centres, we were pleased that we were able to open for primary school children, but it's absolutely clear that if you're going to get a big group of people together and they're going to stay overnight, the chance of the virus spreading is going to be pretty high. And that is the reason why we are taking these measures. We only allow three different households to get together at the moment; if you go way beyond that, of course—. At some point we will have to get to that point, we'll have to understand, but at this point in time I think we've been very careful. We've tried to respond to the sector by saying, 'Yes, you can take primary school children', because of the very points you made. For some of these children, this is the only holiday they're going to have this year and it's the only opportunity for them to get out of the house. We're very sensitive to that, and that's why we were keen to take that step forward. But of course, primary children, we know, if they do contract the virus, they're very unlikely to suffer in the way that the older-age children will. And we have, of course, given financial support.  

In terms of the ice arena, we have asked for specific advice on this, and because of the low temperature in the ice arena, it's clear that the possibility of spreading the virus is greater, and that is why we have adopted the approach that we have. And we are looking at the possibility of ensuring that people who work there in a professional capacity are able to work. 

Thank you. The proposal is to agree the motion. Does any Member object? No. Therefore the motion is agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.

Motion agreed in accordance with Standing Order 12.36.