Questions now from the party leaders. Leader of the Conservatives, Andrew R.T. Davies.

Thank you, Presiding Officer. First Minister, the point you made about speaking to the vice-chancellor of the university in Namibia is well made—that, unless we are all vaccinated, none of us will be safe at the end of this, and it is a global problem that we all need to be focused on. But we are moving into better climes; we are moving into an arena now where some of the restrictions can be unpicked. And Professor John Watkins yesterday highlighted that with the success of the vaccination roll-out and the immunity levels—. I can hear chuntering from the nationalist benches, but I'm sure that they would like to listen to the experts, as I like to listen to the experts as well on this particular subject. We've heard many references to Cardiff University as well, and Professor John Watkins is a member of the academic staff there. Do you believe that his assertion that bringing lockdown to an end is correct and will you be supporting that, First Minister?

Llywydd, I read very carefully what Professor Watkins had to say and I don't believe that he was arguing at all for a tearing up of all the protections that make a difference to our defences against coronavirus. He was saying that there comes a point where we have to be able to move beyond those protections and I agree with that, and I hope that when, tomorrow, I'm here again making a statement about the outcome of the current three-week review, there will be steps that we can take in that direction. What it will not be will be a wholesale abandonment of the collective actions that we have taken during the pandemic and that continue to keep Wales safe in the face of a third wave of coronavirus, which is already testing our health service—760 people fell ill with coronavirus in Wales yesterday alone; the largest number on a single day for many, many, many weeks. And the thought that that is a promising context in which to move rapidly away from the protections that are still there to keep us safe—I'm not persuaded that this is the moment for such an approach.

I read from your comments, First Minister, that we will have a far more measured approach from you tomorrow and that there will not be the move away from restrictions that has been seen in other parts of the United Kingdom, and that's a judgment call for the Governments to have to take. But one of the conversations that is being had around the whole of the UK is around vaccination passports and the use of vaccination passports. I have to say I'm against such mandatory use of vaccination passports; I think they segment our society and they discriminate against people who might have genuine reasons not to be vaccinated. Would you confirm that it is the Welsh Government's continued position not to support the mandatory use of vaccination passports and, if they are to be used at all, it would only be in guidance only?

Yes, Llywydd, I agree with what the leader of the opposition has said. I too am opposed to the mandation of vaccine passports. We make vaccine certificates available to Welsh citizens because they are sometimes required by people wishing to go for foreign travel or sometimes to attend events elsewhere, but those are matters of choice—nobody is forced to go on holiday, nobody has to attend a concert—and the mandation of vaccine certification I think is quite a different matter. I've had a number of conversations with Ministers in the UK Government and they've always assured me that they have no plans to mandate vaccine certification either. And although the Prime Minister, I now see, is encouraging the use of vaccine certification in certain voluntary settings, I think that's still a long way from mandation.

I'm pleased to hear that, First Minister, and I'll also be joining you in supporting that cause, because, as I said, I do think it would create unnecessary divisions within our society. And I appreciate that we're going to have the statement tomorrow, and it doesn't look as if—. Obviously, there will be differences in all parts of the United Kingdom. Now, the Scottish Parliament, for example, is in recall session as we speak, I believe, at 2 o'clock this afternoon—it's not quite 2 o'clock now, but meeting at 2 o'clock this afternoon—the Prime Minister made his announcements yesterday; you'll make your announcements tomorrow. With a third of the population of Wales living within 20 miles of the Welsh border, there has to be an understanding of the obligations and rules that are in place in various parts of the United Kingdom for those rules to be complied with, and it is really important that, where possible, common ground can be reached. Given that we expect there to be differences between what you will announce tomorrow and what has been announced in England, how will you look to try and create that common ground so that the citizens of the countries that are affected by these rules and regulations can know exactly what is expected of them? Because I don't think anyone wants to see a third, a fourth, a fifth wave, and we do want to celebrate the success of the vaccination programme and the immunity that has built up in society as a whole. But we are at a critical moment now, when liberties can be returned, and as many of those liberties should be returned as possible, First Minister.

Well, Llywydd, I met yesterday with the First Minister of Scotland, senior Members from Northern Ireland and with Michael Gove from the Cabinet Office. I think we are—. I said at that meeting that it still seems to me that every part of the United Kingdom is moving in broadly the same direction. We may be doing it at slightly different speeds and in different ways, but the essential direction of travel is the same between us all. We all want to go on lifting restrictions; we all want to do it in a way that keeps people safe.

We all made a plea through Mr Gove that the Prime Minister, in his press conference, should make it clear that he was making announcements for England only. It was disappointing, again, to find that the Prime Minister finds that such a difficult thing to do, because it would have helped—it would've helped with the clarity. And I agree with what Andrew R.T. Davies has said there, Llywydd: trying to be clear with our different populations what the position is in different parts of the United Kingdom is a challenge, and it's one we've all got to address. It would've helped if the Prime Minister had been clearer with people that he was not making an announcement for Northern Ireland or Scotland or for Wales.

I do think people at our borders have become more used to this. They've lived through 18 months of there being differences across the border, and people are more alert to it and look out for it more. We will certainly do whatever we can, once decisions are made—and the Cabinet will be meeting again tomorrow morning; we're yet to finalise all of the announcements that will be made tomorrow—we will do our best to make sure that those are as clearly communicated for Welsh citizens as we can.

On behalf of Plaid Cymru, Rhun ap Iorwerth.

Thank you very much, Llywydd. Yes, it's less than a week, now, until COVID restrictions are removed entirely in England. The chair of the BMA council, Dr Chaand Nagpaul, has described the timing, as the number of cases increases quickly, as being irresponsible, in addition to recent comments made by the World Health Organization, accusing the UK Government of

'moral emptiness and epidemiological stupidity'.

Now, do you agree, given that you are saving those around you by wearing a face covering—it provides some protection for yourself too, of course—that scrapping the need for face coverings now is irresponsible?

Well, Llywydd, of course, the things that are happening in England do raise concerns with us, as a Government, but I'm not going to come here to be critical of what other people are doing; that's a decision for them, to do things in the areas of responsibility that they have. What we see here in Wales, Llywydd, is that there is a relationship between the virus and the vaccine that has changed, but it hasn't disappeared.

Yesterday, there were 69 people in our hospitals in Wales who were confirmed COVID patients—69. Less than a month ago, we were talking about fewer than 20 people, so the number of people who are falling very ill because of the delta variant, that number is growing nearly every day here in Wales. That's why, when the Cabinet considers the possibilities we have in Wales, we are going to proceed in the way that we have throughout the pandemic—namely very carefully, considering the evidence that we have, and taking a phased approach.

Thank you. I was asking you to give your view on what you think is responsible or irresponsible in Wales, and I do encourage you to retain the requirement to wear a face covering in all locations where people come into close contact, including in shops. I read one scenario over the weekend: it would be very odd, according to Councillor Gwynfor Owen in Gwynedd, if a shop worker had to wear a mask to go to the doctor's surgery, but the doctor didn't have to wear a mask to go to the shop.

Now, you have said that pupils won't have to wear masks in classrooms from September. I have concerns about that, given how close pupils are in classrooms, and I would encourage the Government to be uncompromising in pushing for protection for children and young people through things such as strategies to ensure proper ventilation in classrooms and by pushing for vaccination for children and young people. One driver in all of this for me is an increasing concern about the impact of long COVID and the impact of long COVID on children and young people. Tens of thousands of children and young people across the UK are suffering. May I ask whether the First Minister agrees with that concern that I have? And may I ask for real steps to develop expertise in this area to protect children and young people particularly from long COVID?

Llywydd, I do share that concern, and we have more evidence now about the impact of a long COVID on young people, and it's important for us to press ahead and gather more information and have more advice from those who work in that area. In the letter that the Minister for Health and Social Services sent to the schools in Wales, what that letter said was that there was no need to use masks in classrooms 'as a matter of routine'.

So, it wasn't advice that masks should never be worn in a classroom setting; it is more a matter of those risks being weighed up in different class settings. We know that classrooms vary hugely; from a modern twenty-first century school to a school built in the nineteenth century, the physical conditions are very different. As it happened, Llywydd, I was in a conversation with the headteacher of a large school in Cardiff on Friday afternoon, who'd just received the letter, and he was, I think, very positive about it. He was very aware of the Children's Commissioner for Wales's advice about the adverse impact that it has on children when they are wearing masks hour after hour in a school setting, and he felt very confident that he and his staff would be able to make those judgments in the specific settings that they faced as to when wearing a mask would be sensible and when you could safely allow children to learn without being confined to them.

The final point, Llywydd, that Rhun ap Iorwerth made was about making sure that there are services for young people and others who fall ill through long COVID, and my colleague the health Minister made a recent statement on that matter. It's one of our reasons for hesitation in the current circumstances because while the link between falling ill and hospitalisation has undoubtedly been amended by vaccination, large numbers of people falling ill in the community is not to be dismissed as though that wasn't a matter of continuing concern, because the more people who fall ill in the community, the greater the risk there will be that some of those people too will then suffer not just a temporary or minor illness, but an illness that will live with them for weeks and months beyond.

Thank you for those words. You're certainly right that it's about weighing up risks, and given the nature of the debate in some quarters now, some people will listen to me today and to you and think that I'm being overcautious, that I'm being too risk averse, and it's not that. I'm looking at evidence when it comes to masks, for example, and if evidence can point to ways in which we can lift restrictions, let's follow that evidence too. It works both ways.

So, as we head into the school holidays, either you believe that travelling abroad is safe, with the relevant safeguards in place, or you believe it's not. And if not, give us the evidence and put forward regulations that we can vote on. What I don't think you can do is ask people to use their judgment, and you've said repeatedly that you don't think it's the right thing to do, for somebody to go abroad. I'm all for people taking personal responsibility, but, in this context, I think personal judgment really can't be expected to take the place of sound scientific evidence. So, will you provide the clarity that people need on that issue?

Well, here is the only clarity I can provide, Llywydd. The advice of the Welsh Government has not changed for many, many weeks. Our advice to people in Wales is that this is the year to stay in Wales and to take your holiday with everything that Wales to offer. The decision to travel abroad will bring additional risks with it—risks to you as an individual, and risks to others on your return. Those risks can be avoided; they're not risks that you have to run. Therefore, in the context of a global pandemic and a third wave of coronavirus, how much better to avoid those risks and to holiday here in Wales?

The reason we cannot make that a law in Wales is that it would simply be unenforceable. There is just no way you could make such a law stick, because three quarters of people who travel abroad from Wales do so from airports across our border, where there will be no such inhibition. And I don't imagine—I've never seen a proposal from Plaid Cymru—that we would prevent people from Wales from travelling across the border into England, and as soon as you allow that to happen, then people would be able to travel and people would. So, I don't find—. I wish we were in a different position to the one that we are in, but, given that that is the position we are in, the advice we can give is as clear as we can make it: there are risks involved, they don't need to be run, there are alternatives, and fantastic alternatives available to you.