9. Welsh Conservatives Debate: Mental Health

– in the Senedd on 6 October 2021.

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(Translated)

The following amendments have been selected: amendment 1 in the name of Lesley Griffiths, and amendment 2 in the name of Siân Gwenllian. If amendment 1 is agreed, amendment 2 will be deselected.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 3:37, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

The next item is the Welsh Conservative debate on mental health. And I call on Tom Giffard to move the motion.

(Translated)

Motion NDM7793 Darren Millar

To propose that the Senedd:

1. Notes that Sunday 10 October is world mental health day.

2. Recognises the impact of COVID-19 on mental health support and mental health inequalities.

3. Regrets that the number of young people presenting at hospital with self-harming issues has risen by 39 per cent since 2007.

4. Calls on the Welsh Government to include in its replacement 10-year mental health strategy next year:

a) actions to implement recommendations from the Fifth Senedd's Children, Young People and Education Committee’s reports, 'Mind over Matter' and 'Mind over Matter: Two years on';

b) annual reports and the establishment of targets for waiting times for mental health treatment, including the reduction of backlogs;

c) a national rollout of 24-hour mental health crisis centres;

d) a clear mental health workforce plan.

5. Further calls on the Welsh Government to introduce a new mental health Act.

(Translated)

Motion moved.

Photo of Tom Giffard Tom Giffard Conservative 3:37, 6 October 2021

Diolch yn fawr iawn, Llywydd. I'm very pleased to open this Welsh Conservative debate today on the topic of mental health tabled in the name of Darren Millar. This Sunday, 10 October, is World Mental Health Day. We should take this opportunity to reflect on our own mental health, and that of our friends, and of our family, and what we as Senedd Members can do to promote positive mental health across Wales. It's also a day where we all need to reflect and take time to check up on someone. It's a day when we should drop an old friend a text, have a Zoom conversation with a colleague or meet up for a coffee with a family member. You may never know the difference a small act can make on someone struggling with their mental health. 

COVID-19 hasn't been kind to our mental health. And, regrettably, we've seen a sharp rise in the number of children and adults that are suffering. It would be wrong of me not to start by mentioning the work of a great number of mental health charities across Wales, and the UK, that do great work in all of our communities. Mental Health Matters provide crucial services, such as well-being hubs and anxiety and depression peer support groups, whilst the Samaritans operate a helpline service that is available 24 hours a day, seven days a week, 365 days a year. Manned by volunteers, they are often the unsung heroes who have no doubt saved countless lives and are there for us in our hour of need, and we need to be here for them in theirs. 

In Wales, COVID-19 has exposed existing mental health inequalities under the Welsh Labour Government, with many services stretched to the limit, backlogs rising and fewer people accessing the support they so desperately need. Mind Cymru in their 'Too long to wait' report outlined that even before the pandemic, thousands of people were waiting longer than ever to receive psychological therapy. They found that the target of 80 per cent of people being seen within 26 weeks was not met in any of the 17 months to August 2020. But there's no question that COVID-19 has made the problem worse, because Mind also found that when comparing August 2020 to the same period in 2019, whilst the number of people waiting to start psychological therapies fell from 7,198 to 5,208, the number of people waiting longer than 26 weeks rose by 4 per cent, and those waiting longer than a year rose by 17 per cent. And even that decline in the number of individuals on the waiting list may not be the good news that it sounds. It probably means fewer people coming forward, in the first place, to get the help they need, because of the pandemic.

And, we all, sadly, know the effect that lockdowns have had on our mental health, particularly younger people. During the first lockdown in 2020, more than half of Welsh adults and three quarters of young people said their mental health had generally worsened during the early months of the pandemic. And, although anxiety about the pandemic has generally fallen among UK adults, from 42 per cent, in February 2021, loneliness had risen, from 10 per cent in March 2020 to 26 per cent a year later. And perhaps most markedly, there were more than 10 deaths for every 100,000 of the population in 2020 caused by suicide, and that rate is often three to four times higher amongst males than it is females. 

The next 10-year mental health strategy needs to reflect the significant changes we have seen in a post-COVID Wales. I'm sure we all agree that we're in a very different position today to where we were two years ago, and a new strategy needs to reflect that. So, it's in this light that today's Government amendments really are disappointing. Today, we have a real opportunity to put forward a long-term strategy, to ensure a proper review of mental health services—are fit both for today and the future. So, to see them watered down by the Government amendments are a real, real missed opportunity. What we need are targets, and we need outcomes, and for this Senedd to be able to hold the Welsh Government to account on them. And I'm afraid these Government amendments do not achieve either of those objectives. 

Our motion is constructive. We don't table it today to level criticism at the Government or anybody else. Whilst there were clear problems in mental health services across Wales before the pandemic, we all recognise the last year and a half has put an incredible strain on our mental health services. The solutions to tackle it need to be updated to reflect that, and that's why I call on every Member of this Senedd to back our motion today. 

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 3:42, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

I have selected two amendments to the motion. If amendment 1 is agreed, amendment 2 will be deselected. I call on the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being, Lynne Neagle, to formally move amendment 1 tabled in the name of Lesley Griffiths. 

(Translated)

Amendment 1—Lesley Griffiths

Delete all after point 2 and replace with:

Notes the commitment to review the evidence, data and current service provision around all age self-harm in Wales.

Welcomes the Welsh Government's continued commitment to:

a) implement recommendations from the Fifth Senedd's Children, Young People and Education Committee’s reports, 'Mind over Matter' and 'Mind over Matter: Two years on';

b) strengthen and publish mental health waiting time data and improve performance across Wales;

c) a national roll-out of 24-hour mental health crisis support;

d) a clear mental health workforce plan.

Calls on the Welsh Government to ensure the reform of the UK Mental Health Act is fit for Wales and aligns with current related legislation in Wales.

(Translated)

Amendment 1 moved.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour

(Translated)

Thank you. I call on Rhun ap Iorwerth to move amendment 2 tabled in the name of Siân Gwenllian.    

(Translated)

Amendment 2—Siân Gwenllian

Add as new sub-point at end of point 4:

'the roll-out of a network of preventative youth mental health and wellbeing centres’.

(Translated)

Amendment 2 moved.

Photo of Rhun ap Iorwerth Rhun ap Iorwerth Plaid Cymru 3:42, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

Thank you very much, Dirprwy Lywydd. I want to take this opportunity to urge the Government and the Minister here to raise their game, to show greater urgency in their response to the mental health crisis that we are facing at the moment. And the Minister, herself, is one, I know, who feels passionately about mental health. That's why she is in post. But that passion now needs to translate into a determination to take action, serious action, on a large scale, without any delay. I'll support that work in any way. We've collaborated in the past, on a committee. There is no reason why we can't all be agreed here on what needs to be done, even though we would bring different ideas to the table on how to achieve this, and it's important that we do, in order to move forward, share ideas. We'll support the Conservatives' motion. We, on these benches, have put forward similar suggestions in the past. I hope that everyone here can support our amendment too. I'll turn to that in a moment.

But I urge the Government, because the crisis is getting ever worse. This week, I received news about another young person losing their life after a long battle with mental health issues. I think about the pain that that person went through, and the pain that their family and friends are going through now. I heard about a young woman from the same area, who lost her life recently. We know about the strain that the pandemic has caused to our young people. They've lost so much: they've lost those important milestones in their lives; they've lost that companionship; the normality; the structure; they've lost educational opportunities; and they've lost access to services, because of COVID pressures on those services. 

But, of course, that lack of sustainability and the lack of resources and continuity in mental health services were there a long time before the virus hit. Is it acceptable that a young man from my constituency was advised to go outwith his own health board to receive support for an eating disorder because the GP didn't have any confidence in the local provision, and then had to wait several months for an appointment? And others, of course, are waiting far longer than months—they can be waiting for years for therapies and some treatments.

The progress report on the work of the Children, Young People and Education Committee, the report that was published almost exactly a year ago now, two years after the original report, 'Mind over matter', states that

'our children and young people are still struggling to find the emotional and mental health support they need, whether that is at an early stage to help prevent problems developing, or later down the line, when things have become worse and specialist help and care is needed.'

Now, the current mental health Minister was the chair of that committee at the time, and she, I'm sure, will be eager to progress that work, to address those three central points in the report, and the three points that they asked about, namely that we need to do more to make improvements sooner; that we need to work in a whole-system approach with all parts of the service playing their part; and that the impact of the pandemic makes progress even more important.

We've outlined some of our specific ideas in the amendment today. We call once again for that network of mental health and well-being centres where young people can receive support before issues become more acute. But our aim, of course, is to improve and accelerate access to care and treatment at all levels, and, as I say, we all need to have that clear, laser focus on that aim.

There is a danger, of course, that a Government amendment, such as that we see today, could be seen as, 'Don't worry, we're doing everything already. Our commitment is clear enough.' But words aren't enough. Please, Minister, do show that commitment through actions now for the whole population, but particularly our young people.

Photo of John Griffiths John Griffiths Labour 3:47, 6 October 2021

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. In tackling mental health issues I think it’s very important that all organisations that can play a role do so, and all organisations think about what they can do to actively help, and I'm very pleased that in my local area in Newport we have a football club, Newport County, who've been very keen to do just that. They've been looking at how they can reach out beyond their core activity, as it were, in being a successful football club—and I hope we have considerable success on the field this season. They're reaching out into the community, they're doing a lot of community work, and in terms of mental health they became the fourth English Football League club to sign a charter on sport and recreation and how mental health work can be aided through the power of sport and the powerful role models that footballers can be. So, I think it's really encouraging that an organisation like Newport County are thinking that way.

They were the first football club in Wales to sign the charter, and I hope others will follow, and they're determined to make it a success. It's about being part of a network, working with partners like the local authority and the health service, getting all the partners to sign a pledge to take forward joint work and to understand how they can effectively work together, and then to monitor that work to make sure that actual progress is being made. It's about positive messaging, tackling discrimination, and using the power of the football club and the football players. And I think it's particularly important for men's mental health, which is a particular problem; men sometimes are particularly reluctant to talk about mental health, to admit vulnerability. And when they see powerful role models, such as footballers, willing to do that, willing to share their experience and their problems, I really do think that can be quite powerful, and I think that's proving to be the case. They've got people with designated responsibility within the club to take this forward. They've linked with all the front-line political representatives, such as myself, locally. So, it really is building up to be a considerable team effort. And I'd also like to highlight the work of Newport City Council as part of that, but also in terms of their Arrow project, which is particularly working with young people around their mental health issues, and working with all the schools in the area. Again, I think that's being recognised as good practice, and it's an organisation going that extra step, doing something beyond its core activities, to understand the challenges of mental health and help to address them.

So, I'm sure that the Minister would agree that, if we really are to make the progress we need to make in Wales, we need this stepping up to the plate from all those organisations that really can add to the collective effort of the health service, of key partners. It has to be everybody's business, doesn't it? And organisations like Newport County, Newport City Council, I think are showing a good example, and I hope many others across Wales will emulate their actions and, hopefully, their success.

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative 3:51, 6 October 2021

'Mind over matter: Two years on' clearly concludes that the wider effects of COVID-19 have impacted children and our young people's lives significantly. And, again, I'm going to pay tribute to Lynne Neagle for all the work that you've done with 'Mind over matter', and I know how passionate and dedicated you are to seeing an improvement in the mental health of our young people.

Barnardo's UK-wide practitioners' survey proves this, because 95 per cent of 275 respondents reported an increase in the number of children and young people experiencing mental health and well-being issues. We owe it to our young people of Wales to ensure that all the calls in the 'Two years on' report are acted on, such as better signposting, addressing the gaps in service, provision for the lower level, therapeutic support, and further work on monitoring the quality and availability of services. The same has to be true for adult services.

Sadly, in north Wales, and in my own constituency, I'm faced, on a weekly basis, where there are such inconsistencies. I'll just give you an insight into just one of my cases, which now proves how dire the situation has become. Due to Conwy community mental health team not having enough social workers based within the team, a very vulnerable constituent of mine was referred to Conwy County Borough Council's community well-being team. Shockingly, despite CMHT—that's the mental health team—being aware of the outcome of the referral, they then discharged a vulnerable individual. The local authority have now confirmed that the referral was not received by them from the CMHT. A review with a consultant psychiatrist found that the individual should have had a care co-ordinator. As we speak—and despite me asking for the past six weeks, and despite the fact my constituent was discharged, as part of COVID measures, over 18 months ago—that constituent still remains on the waiting list. And the situation gets worse. Because there is no care co-ordinator, it has been explained there cannot be a care and treatment plan. Well, I'm sorry, but I sat here during the Social Services and Well-being (Wales) Act 2014, where these plans are supposed to be in place but are not. So, it's a disgraceful standard of care and attention to a very vulnerable individual.

We need annual reports that provide an honest picture as to the severity of the situation on the ground, and we need to help this Welsh Parliament understand what actions are needed to support mental health professionals assisting our communities. I am going to work with Lynne on this, and I have been doing up to now as a Member for a constituency. I want to see a clear mental health workforce plan, and I want a short-term crisis strategy put in place. As part of this, I encourage you to back this campaign to see a trained mental health professional in every GP surgery across our constituencies.

Again, speaking to GPs—I've spoken to one today, and he said, 'The actual time we had a mental health nurse in our practice, it meant we didn't have to refer on; we were able to deal with people at the time'. So, the need for this to be driven forward cannot be starker than when remembering the fact—and this is really sad to reiterate—that more than 3.2 million antidepressant items were prescribed by GPs in Wales in the six months after the COVID pandemic, an increase of 115,660 compared to the previous year, whilst the number of people referred for talking therapies has fallen by a third. 

I wish to close by reminding the Senedd that, alongside the heartbreaking 40 per cent increase in young people presenting in hospital with self-harming, we continue to see a worrying suicide rate in Wales—10.3 deaths per 100 per cent population in 2020. And I've had in my inbox today a note from Samaritans on some really stark reading, which I will read more fully later, but they are really concerned about the cases they're dealing with.

Now, whilst I appreciate, Deputy Llywydd, that there are unique circumstances leading to each of the 285 lives lost, it is a fact that the number of lives affected are considerably higher when you take into account the family and the loved ones who pick up the pieces after such tragic occurrences. It is wrong that the only official contact some families are receiving are police officers informing them of the tragic loss, and then that is it. Those who have been bereaved by suicide become themselves an at-risk group and need specialist practical support, not just in the immediate aftermath.

Whilst I look forward to the publication of the Welsh Government's national framework for the delivery of bereavement care in Wales, an interim study by Cardiff University has found that high levels of emotional support are needed.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 3:56, 6 October 2021

Can the Member conclude now, please?

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative

Yes. So, let's all work together with the Minister, with the Deputy Minister, cross party, and ensure that we can actually return here in a year's time and see that the statistics for the lack of support have decreased. Thank you—diolch.

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru

Children's happiness should surely be one of the metrics any Government or society takes most seriously. Now, it's not always easy to quantify happiness or to pinpoint how contentedness manifests itself, but, when patterns develop and take hold, we all have to take notice. Last year, a Cardiff University study was published that had interviewed children in 35 countries across the world. The study asked them about how happy they felt at home, at school, about their future, about themselves, and, in many aspects, Welsh children had some of the lowest scores. The interviews happened long before COVID, and, as Platfform have reminded Members of the Senedd in preparing for today's debate, COVID-19 hit those who were already having the hardest time the hardest. I know that we're all used to hearing politicians talk about research or statistics or findings, and the tendency is that we switch off, but that study—it's the kind of thing should make us all sit up and take notice. We should be stopped in our tracks. Because the findings, regrettably, are not unique. 'The Good Childhood Report 2021' by the Children's Society looks at answers given by children aged 10 to 15 about how happy they are, and the mean happiness scores for how those children feel about life as a whole, their friendships and their appearance were lower than when the survey began in 2009-10. I've been looking at the report, and some of the most painful estimates that can be extrapolated for Welsh children are that an estimated 24,000 children in Wales recorded low happiness at school, and 30,000 said they were unhappy about their appearance.

Now, there are wider societal issues that need to be addressed here—wider than any one Government can handle alone—to do with the emphasis we place on looks, the impact that Instagram and magazines can have on body image and the ways in which bullying can be made worse both on and because of those platforms. There has to be an urgent acknowledgment and plan in place to deal with and tackle those issues, because we're talking here about feelings that are worryingly common for so many children.

But, more widely, what can we do to help children and young people with mental health? Dirprwy Lywydd, our amendment, as has been set out, calls for a network of preventative youth mental health and well-being centres. That help in the community should sit alongside counselling available in schools, so that there's always somewhere trusted that young people can turn to when they just need to chat through their issues, where they feel safe. Now, this chimes with what the Children's Society has called for in terms of open-access hubs offering drop-in support on a self-referral basis. But, Dirprwy Lywydd, what about those children and young people who are in crisis? The children's commissioner has, I know, released a report this week, emphasising the need for crisis care for young people's mental health. She's pointed out that A&E waiting rooms are not appropriate places for young people to have to go when they're in crisis, that we need sanctuaries and dedicated mental health crisis centres for young people, and this resonated. The commissioner said that too often children and young people are expected to fit into rigid pathways that don't always work for them, and face long waiting times.

I said at the beginning of my remarks, Dirprwy Lywydd, that it's not always easy to quantify happiness. Regrettably, it is all too easy, at times, to quantify extreme unhappiness when it results in crisis, queues of people waiting for overstretched services, the metrics of hopelessness stretching ahead of us. I know the Government wants to get this right, I know that the Minister truly does, so alongside the practical need for crisis centres for community hubs, can we please refocus the indicators we use about children's well-being? As well as the external things that we can measure, like attainment, employment and housing, can we pay more heed to what children feel in their heads, how they are coping, what they tell us about what is going on? Can we follow the Children's Society's advice and include those indicators in how surveys are conducted in Wales to inform public policy, yes, and to listen to those children, because that could be the most powerful intervention that we could make?

Photo of Altaf Hussain Altaf Hussain Conservative 4:01, 6 October 2021

Thank you for the opportunity to speak in this debate. I have said on more than one occasion that the COVID pandemic has exposed the weaknesses in many of our services, and a lack of progress in developing world-class mental health services is sadly another example of where this country is now struggling. Mental health knows no boundaries, it does not restrict itself according to one section of population or another. It can take, regardless of a person's status, and whilst there is much we can do to maintain good mental health, sometimes the realities of life can be too overwhelming.

I want to focus my remarks today on the impact of mental health on children and young people, and the importance of getting this right. Previous committees of the Senedd have focused on the issue of children and mental health. The 'Mind over matter: Two years on' report published in 2020 concluded that while some positive changes have been made to mental health provision for children and young people,

'children and young people are still struggling to find the emotional and mental health support they need'.

The committee argued that improvements to mental health services are not happening quickly enough, there are gaps within existing services, and the impact of the pandemic means a strong focus on the emotional and mental health of children is more essential than ever. I know that we allocate a lot of money to mental health services and that there has historically been a worrying challenge in recruiting the right number of the right skill mix of clinicians into mental health services. This is a workforce issue that must be prioritised if we are to be able to respond to current and future demands. Whilst the Welsh Government has stated that it is taking steps to understand demands as well as how effective existing pathways are, the report's early findings clearly showed that children and young people were finding it difficult to access the service, as it was too adult focused.

As an orthopaedic surgeon, this is one of the reasons why I want us to address the need for mental health emergency care. Services do not reflect the realities of life. If a man can break his leg late on a Saturday night and be treated by a clinician at an A&E department, why can't the same principle apply to someone whose injury is one of the mind? Breaks can mend and, physically, the quicker those breaks are treated, the better; the same too for mental ill health, the chances of stabilisation and recovery are better if responded to quickly. The man with a broken leg has no more right to help than a teenager with a broken mind. He has no more right to ongoing support to recover than a teenager whose mental health might need a period of support. He has no more right to be prioritised when, in six months, he breaks his other leg than the teenager who has a mental relapse. It is time we addressed the imbalance, and with urgency. Thank you.

Photo of Rhianon Passmore Rhianon Passmore Labour 4:05, 6 October 2021

This debate today is an incredibly important one and apt in its timing. Even before the pandemic, one in four people in Wales were experiencing mental health issues, and data indicates levels of anxiety within the population are higher than pre-pandemic. COVID-19 has of course had an impact on the mental well-being of us all, but for those with pre-existing mental health conditions, life in the pandemic has been an especially difficult time. 

We know that the pandemic has had a significant impact on the mental health of young people, with anxiety levels higher than they were, and research shows that mental health issues predominantly start when individuals are children or young people. Therefore, I welcome—I strongly welcome—despite austerity, the additional £5 million of Welsh Government funding to improve and expand school counselling, fund local authorities to recruit and train counsellors, fund the development of professional training for school staff on well-being issues, and improve children's mental well-being.

As a former teacher, I know just how important it is that we provide additional support for young people's mental well-being. And, while providing mental health support is critical, prioritising services to improve prevention is also important. With Wales's income at 2010 levels in 2021, austerity has augmented, undoubtedly, the pressures on services, on social workers, and on crisis mental health teams.

And I know that, for me, speaking personally, music is hugely important to my mental well-being. But, unfortunately, that is not a privilege everyone can today enjoy across Wales. Improving mental health cannot be just reactive, it must be proactive and holistic. Improving access to the arts and sports, allowing us to express our creativity, we already know that improves our mental well-being, and it must be a critical part of our wider arts strategy to improve mental health. We await the imminent work on the national music service to conclude, and I urge both expediency and long-sightedness, and a national music strategy for Wales that is fit for purpose, well funded and caters for additional learning needs, well-being and future generations. And there remains more that we can and should do. 

I welcome the Welsh Government's commitment to roll out 24-hour mental health crisis support, but the Tories opposite must also recognise—they must recognise, and they fail to do so—that factors such as income insecurity, lack of money and debt impact strongly on mental health, and those already on lower incomes are more likely to experience mental health issues. It is extremely worrying, Deputy Llywydd, to conclude, that the Tory UK Government's £20 universal credit cut coming into force today—this debate is apt, as I said—will have a strong negative impact on the mental health of a huge number of recipients.

So, Minister, what assurance can you provide that services will be improved across Wales, despite ongoing austerity budgets, to ensure that nobody is disadvantaged in their access to services because of their location? And, Minister, what assurance can you provide that priority will be given to preventative services, including within the national music strategy and service, to improve holistic mental well-being, as we recover from this pandemic and step into a brighter and healthier Wales? Thank you. 

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 4:09, 6 October 2021

I was delighted when the new Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being was appointed because I know of her personal passion to want to get to grips with the problems that we've had in our young people's mental health services over the years, and I was a member of the Children, Young People and Education Committee when it produced its 'Mind over matter' report. And I'm very much hoping that the Minister will be able to address many of the concerns that, unfortunately, we all know, are still lingering in the aftermath of that report. Many of the recommendations, of course, were accepted by the Welsh Government, some were not, to the angst of the then Chair of the committee. But, quite clearly, this is something that we need to work on a cross-party basis to address and we have always done so when it comes to mental health in this Senedd over the years. 

My own constituency, of course, is located in the area that is served by the Betsi Cadwaladr University Health Board, and it's a matter of deep regret to me that that health board has had in the past major challenges in the delivery of its mental health services, with scandalous care provided to elderly people on the Tawel Fan ward in the Ablett unit. And also, it unfortunately still has some huge and significant problems going forward. It remains in special measures to all intents and purposes, the highest level of intervention, in relation to those mental health challenges that it still has, even some six years on since the organisation went into special measures. I think, Deputy Minister, we will be looking to you to really raise that issue up the priority list, so that we can ensure that the people of north Wales get the levels of care and treatment, access to treatment, that they deserve.

We know at the moment—. Yes, I'll happily take an intervention.

Photo of Jack Sargeant Jack Sargeant Labour 4:11, 6 October 2021

Thank you, Darren Millar, for taking this intervention. I do welcome this debate. World Mental Health Day is 10 October, but we should remember that it's actually every single day. And in terms of the level of support and services, I think the Member is right: we do need to address those issues and I was pleased also that the Minister got this portfolio, with her true passion.

I say this as someone who is a genuine statistic of the one in four people with mental health: do you agree with me that, actually, it's four in four people who have mental health and, some days, mine's worse than yours, and vice versa, and that's an issue we have to address, and there are levels of service, as you suggested, that need to get better and more accessible? There's a level of service, as John Griffiths suggested, with Newport County—a fantastic club—but also there's a service we do to each other, and the Member has picked me up on my terrible days, when I did not want to focus on the day, with a simple bear hug and a cwtsh. That is just as important. Do you agree with that?

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 4:12, 6 October 2021

I certainly do agree that, sometimes, just a hug makes a huge difference and I also acknowledge that everybody has bad days with their mental health. They can feel down or upset or anxious about all sorts of different things. And we must recognise that having poor mental health should have no stigma attached to it. We do have to make sure that it is a priority, as Altaf Hussain said, that is given equal priority with people's physical health and unfortunately that's not the case at the moment.

Just returning to the statistics in north Wales, at the moment, mental health assessments within 28 days for people of all ages: only 59 per cent of people are actually seen within that target. And for young people, regrettably, Deputy Minister, it's even worse: just over a quarter are seen within that target for an assessment, that 28-day period, and this is in spite of the focus that you brought to this issue those three years ago when the report was published, 'Mind over matter'. We also know that one in four of those are waiting a very long time for therapy once they've been assessed, up to 18 months in some cases in north Wales, and clearly that's not good enough when we're dealing with people's lives and wanting to give them the tools to be able to equip themselves with improving their mental health for themselves.

The CAMHS unit in Abergele, the north Wales adolescent service, was built in 2008. It was opened by Edwina Hart, the then health Minister. There were 18 beds in that unit, and there are still 18 beds in that unit, but it has never been utilised to its full capacity. At the moment, only 12 beds are actually accessed by people who need them, and we're still unfortunately sending people miles away over the border into England in order to access services that could be accessed on their doorstep in north Wales.

So, I'd urge you, Deputy Minister: keep a focus on this issue. I know that your heart is absolutely with everybody in this Chamber in wanting to get to grips with these challenges, but I would be most grateful and so would my constituents if you took the time to focus on those challenges that have been persistent in north Wales for six years now. We know there are examples of good practice across the country, we just wish it was more consistently applied in our area.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 4:14, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

I call on the Deputy Minister for Mental Health and Well-being, Lynne Neagle.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer, and thank you to everybody who's spoken today. I do welcome this debate, and with World Mental Health Day almost upon us, this is a good opportunity to discuss the importance of protecting and supporting our mental health and well-being. We're 12 months into the implementation of our 'Together for Mental Health' delivery plan, revised in response to the pandemic, and I'm looking forward to reporting our progress to Members in a statement in this Chamber next week.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 4:15, 6 October 2021

The pandemic has had a major impact on all our mental health, in very many different ways. As Jack Sargeant has highlighted, we all have mental health, and some days it's good, some days it's not so good. We've seen that the anxiety of those who've felt isolated and alone in lockdown has been matched for some by apprehension about rejoining society as restrictions are lifted. For some, we know that the pandemic represented a chance to reconnect with communities, as neighbours came together in support, and where families were able to spend more time together. That's why, whilst the impact of COVID is likely to be detrimental, it's vital for us to understand in more detail the impact on certain groups.

We continue to strengthen the arrangements that we put in place at the start of the pandemic. Our analytical support is drawing out the latest evidence and outcomes from population surveys in Wales and across the UK. We've established a ministerial mental health oversight and delivery board, which I chair personally. It is providing me with greater assurance on the progress being made in delivering our mental health programme of work, but also the opportunity to challenge if I feel insufficient pace is being employed or progress being made. Importantly, the board membership includes Public Health Wales and our knowledge and analytical services to strengthen our analytical support.

Analysis has shown that whilst levels of anxiety have remained higher than pre pandemic, we have seen fluctuations, and understandably, levels of anxiety have reduced when restrictions have been eased. Aspects of personal health and well-being, concern about the health and well-being of others, and personal finances have all caused worries for individuals to differing extents over the course of lockdown. We also know that the impact has not been felt consistently across all groups. Responses to surveys show that certain groups of people, such as those with pre-existing mental health conditions, young adults, black, Asian and minority ethnic communities, those in lower-income households and women, for example, report higher levels of mental health concerns than others, and have done so throughout the pandemic. We know that surveys by the Children's Commissioner for Wales also highlight the impact on children and young people.

In October 2020, our 'Together for Mental Health' delivery plan was revised in response to these changes and other evidence, and now includes a range of new or accelerated actions to provide additional support where it is most needed. In particular, we have strengthened and expanded our tier 0 offer to provide open access to a range of non-clinical mental health support. This can be accessed over the phone or online and doesn't need a referral from a health professional. Much of this support is being provided by the third sector, who I join Tom Giffard in thanking, and they are also often so well placed to reach the most marginalised and vulnerable communities across Wales. We know, too, that for some groups, overcoming stigma in seeking mental health support is particularly hard. Our mental health delivery plan therefore includes specific actions that are overseen by the stigma and discrimination sub-group of our mental health national partnership board. This includes a dedicated black, Asian and minority ethnic task and finish group that is currently reviewing what further action is required to support diverse communities accessing mental health support.

I also recognise, in relation to the motion today, the need to strengthen our oversight in response to the incidence of self-harm in Wales. Research led by Swansea University shows that whilst we've seen an increase in self-harm in young people over the last 10 years, numbers have dropped across all ages during the pandemic, based on hospital and accident and emergency admissions. The incidence of self-harm is now similar to pre-pandemic levels. But I am not in any way complacent. Self-harming behaviour is complex, and the NHS admissions data is only one element of the information we need to better understand levels of self-harm in Wales. We will do all that we can to reduce incidence of self-harm. I can confirm that the NHS Wales collaborative commissioning unit and Improvement Cymru are establishing a programme of work to review the evidence and data to support our approach to self-harm prevention.

In response to Janet Finch-Saunders's comments about suicide rates, can I assure the Member that we are monitoring suicide rates very, very closely, as is happening throughout the UK? The evidence currently suggests that we are not seeing a rise in suicide rates as a result of the pandemic, but we are not in any way complacent about that. That's why we are introducing a means of real-time surveillance so that we can—[Interruption.] Go on, then. 

Photo of Janet Finch-Saunders Janet Finch-Saunders Conservative 4:20, 6 October 2021

Thank you. Recently, I've been contacted by the Bishop of Bangor, who has raised with me his real, serious concerns about the numbers of suicides in north Wales. In particular, he's highlighted young men. Is it possible, therefore—? He has asked—I was going to write to you—whether you would consider us holding a meeting so that we can discuss those concerns. Because if a man of the cloth comes forward to say that there's an issue, clearly, he's a member working hard in the community, and I think his concerns should be taken seriously.  

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Thank you, Janet, for that. I'd be very happy to meet with the individual that you mention, but I should re-emphasise that we are not, thankfully, seeing a rise in suicide rates at the moment. It is very important that all of us are really responsible in the language that we use about suicide, because when we talk about rates, people say things like, 'Rates going through the roof', and what have you. Vulnerable people hear that and it can influence their behaviour. 

We are putting in place real-time surveillance so that we are aware, without having to wait for inquests, of the actual suicide rate on an ongoing basis. And what that also means is that we can immediately provide support to the families and others bereaved by suicide. You're absolutely right about the impact of suicide; it devastates families, friends and whole communities. What we are looking to do—and I'm confident we're making progress in that—is put in place a post-suicide bereavement pathway for everyone affected by suicide. 

Turning, then, to mental health services during the pandemic, as Members know, they have remained accessible during the pandemic, but waiting times to access support have been affected and some targets have not been met. We acknowledge that waiting times across Wales, especially for children and young people, are a challenge, but one I can assure Members I am determined to address as a matter of urgency.

However, changing targets or creating new ones is not the answer here. In my regular contact with health boards, I am pressing them on my plans to address waiting times, and have gone further when I have felt the situation is more serious, while recognising that this is not something that can be resolved overnight. And, as I've already said, we've invested heavily in our tier 0 open access support. At the same time, I am determined to progress our early intervention and prevention whole-system approach for children and adults, to ensure that everyone can access the right support at the right time. This will only help service pressures and waiting times to reduce. 

We are making good progress to improve crisis care, and I'll provide more information on this in my statement next week. I can reiterate our commitment to have all-age 24/7 mental health single points of contact available in each health board area by April 2022. However, the NHS response is only one element of a wider cross-Government and multi-agency response that is needed. As John Griffiths said in his contribution, mental health is everybody's business. 

I fully understand that having the right workforce in place is crucial, and our mental health delivery plan includes this as an underpinning aim. As well as expanding the workforce, we also need the right mix of professionals able to provide mental health support. Health Education and Improvement Wales and Social Care Wales are making good progress in developing a transformative, longer term workforce vision and plan for mental health and social care in Wales. 

We know that the pandemic has had a huge impact on our whole NHS workforce, so as well as the forward planning work that HEIW are undertaking, I'm also looking at what further we can do now to strengthen our existing workforce in the light of the current workforce pressures and our forecast increasing mental health demand. I will say more about that to the Chamber in due course. 

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 4:24, 6 October 2021

Deputy Minister, if you can conclude now. 

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Oh, have I run out of time? 

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour

I've given you additional time because of the intervention, but you've gone well beyond that. 

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour

Can I just turn, then, to the Plaid Cymru amendment? I have discussed these plans that Plaid are putting forward with Rhun ap Iorwerth previously, but I believe that our current approach to ensure preventative support is provided across a number of settings—through schools, colleges, youth clubs and services, where children live their lives on an everyday basis—is the right one. Our new NEST framework, which is being co-produced with young people across Wales, together with our whole-school approach, will deliver that.

Can I just conclude, Deputy Llywydd, by saying that driving change and improvement in mental health support, particularly for children and young people, has been central to my work in this Senedd? It was under my leadership that the children and young people committee's 'Mind over matter' report was published. I am proud of the changes that report has led to, in particular the development of our whole-school approach and a really strong focus on early intervention. There is more work to do across the whole system, but Members can be in no doubt that I am absolutely determined to deliver on this agenda for children and for adults in my new role in Government. Diolch yn fawr.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 4:26, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

I call on Samuel Kurtz to reply to the debate. 

Photo of Samuel Kurtz Samuel Kurtz Conservative

(Translated)

I thank all Members for contributing to the debate and to the Deputy Minister for responding.

Photo of Samuel Kurtz Samuel Kurtz Conservative

Thank you to all Members for taking part, and to the Deputy Minister for her response and steadfast determination to bring about the necessary change in this.

We stand here at a critical moment, and with the topic being debated today so pertinent, it would be remiss of me not to share my own personal story. Like the Member for Alyn and Deeside, I too am a statistic. Like many last year, during the lockdown, once the novelty of homeworking wore off and only seeing friends on Zoom call quizzes, I quickly felt isolated, lonely, and this was compounded by the fact that I lived alone. As Delyth Jewell, the Member for South Wales East, mentioned, it's difficult to quantify it, and I didn't realise that this was happening at the time, that I was struggling. I became short-tempered and snappy. I swapped the early morning walks to remain hidden under the duvet. I now look back and realise, with absolute clarity, that my mental health was under strain. Thankfully, as the lockdown eased, I was able to meet with friends and play sport. I know that for the Member for Islwyn, it was music; for me, it was sport. I felt the improvements to my mental health immediately. I know, from speaking to friends and colleagues, that I wasn't the only one who felt this way during the lockdowns.

But it shows that no-one is immune to poor mental health. Many of us, at some stage, will suffer to varying degrees. As Altaf Hussain said, mental health knows no barriers and does not discriminate. However, as the Member for South Wales West, Tom Giffard, rightly highlighted, Welsh mental health services were struggling long before COVID, and, as it stands, I suspect the same struggles will continue long after the pandemic. That's why this motion today, before Members, is so important. We've heard the many statistics this afternoon that make for difficult listening: one in four will suffer mental health problems at some point in their lives; loneliness has increased to 26 per cent during the pandemic; the sharp rise of antidepressants being prescribed, as the Member for Aberconwy mentioned; and that the Welsh Government's target of 80 per cent of local primary mental health support service assessments being undertaken within 28 days has not been met for the last eight months. As a consequence of this, we've seen community-led organisations across Wales lead the way in delivering life-saving mental health services.

I'd like to take the opportunity to pay tribute to two charitable organisations that do amazing work to support people with their mental health. In Pembrokeshire, former soldier Barry John had an idea: to help support our armed forces veterans with their mental health through art therapy. From that idea, the VC Gallery in Pembroke Dock and Haverfordwest was born. With Barry's artistic background and his involvement in mental health work, he realised the need in the community for his expertise and experiences. Now, the VC Gallery is working with veterans, older people, children, and anyone who feels they need time out to socialise and express themselves through art. Nationally, there are organisations such as the DPJ Foundation who work with our agricultural community, a sector with alarmingly high levels of mental health issues, to help those who need it to share the load. From the tragedy of Daniel Picton-Jones's suicide, his widow, Emma, decided to set up the foundation to support the mental health of those in the farming sector, for those who feel just as Daniel did, providing them with the support that he didn't know how to get.

These exceptional charities are only two of many that provide support, guidance, a listening ear and even a shoulder to cry on for those who need it. And in responding to the Member from Newport East, it’s fantastic what Newport county are doing. I know, personally, that sport is such a great motivator in improving mental health. But it shouldn’t be down to sports clubs and charities to do this work alone. That’s why this motion is so very important—to deliver a national roll-out of 24-hour mental health crisis centres, a clear mental health workforce plan and annual reports and targets for waiting times for mental health treatment, including a reduction in backlogs.

The more we learn about mental health, indeed, the more we talk about mental health, the better we can provide helpful and targeted support to those in our lives who struggle with mental health conditions. It’s okay not to be okay, but it is not okay to sit on our hands when it comes to mental health provision. Deputy Minister, I look forward to your statement on mental health provision going forward, but today, I urge all Members to vote for this motion. Diolch yn fawr.

Photo of David Rees David Rees Labour 4:31, 6 October 2021

(Translated)

The proposal is to agree the motion without amendment. Does any Member object? Yes. Therefore I will defer voting on this motion until voting time.

(Translated)

Voting deferred until voting time.