Item 8 is next, and it's a statement by the Deputy Minister for Social Partnership: fair work—annual progress update. I call on the Deputy Minister, Hannah Blythyn.

Diolch, Ddirprwy Lywydd. A better deal for workers is central to a fairer, more equal and more prosperous Wales. Not only is this the right thing to do by workers, but it also benefits our workplaces, our economy and our country as a whole. We're working in partnership across Government and with our social partners to use every lever we have to promote and enable fair work, address labour exploitation and tackle modern slavery.

The Welsh Government established a Fair Work Commission to make recommendations on how we can promote fair work, and its report continues to frame our approach. I'm pleased that we've actioned all six of the commission's priority recommendations, including making annual updates such as this, and we're making good progress on many other recommendations. However, it's important we interpret the work of the Fair Work Commission in ways that enable us to respond in real time. This is because the world of work continues to change and the pace and scale of change, such as the movement towards hybrid working, has accelerated over the past two years. Whilst the coronavirus pandemic has demonstrated that different ways of working are possible, it's also brought sector and Wales-wide challenges into sharper focus and starkly revealed how inequalities risk being entrenched. As we transition out of the pandemic, it's never been timelier to take stock and take action to enable a future of fairer work.

Of course, fair work spans devolved and reserved matters, affecting what we can do on fair work and how we can do it. We have five broad levers at our disposal, and we're making use of all of them. Firstly, we directly influence working conditions in the devolved public sector. Secondly, we use our procurement levers and the power of the public purse to encourage fair work. Thirdly, we use our convening power, bringing together social partners and others to foster fair work and champion good practice. Fourthly, we support individuals and organisations to upskill and access fair work. And finally, we seek to influence reserved employment rights, duties and protections that will have an impact on workers and workplaces in Wales.

On a sector level, we have worked in social partnership through the social care fair work forum. The forum has played the key role in taking forward our programme for government commitment to pay the real living wage in social care. This uplift will begin to hit pay packets in the coming month, and the forum continues to work together to address and seek solutions to the wider challenges we know the sector and those working in it face. We've built on this experience, establishing a retail forum, which is working to embed fair work in our vision for retail. Working in social partnership, we aim to mainstream fair work in other sectors where there are acute and urgent challenges, such as the sectors involved in the visitor economy.

On particular aspects of fair work, we have made progress with the real living wage. We are clear that the real living wage is a component, not a conclusive part, of fair work. Last year saw a record increase in the number of living-wage accredited employers, an impressive 44 per cent increase on the previous year. The proportion of all employee jobs in Wales paid at least the real living wage has continued to rise, at just over 82 per cent in 2021, compared to just under 78 per cent in 2020, closing the gap with the position across the UK as whole, but we need to sustain that progress. We have partnered with Cynnal Cymru as the Living Wage Foundation's accreditation partner in Wales, funding them to support their capacity to engage employers and accelerate real living wage adoption and accreditation.

We're embedding fair work into our approaches across Government. Fair work is a core theme in our recently published plan for employability and skills, and we're working to improve the reach and impact of mechanisms such as the economic contract and the code of practice on ethical employment in supply chains. We are on track to introduce a social partnership and public procurement Bill, and I'm pleased to say Members will have the opportunity to scrutinise this Bill later this year. In addition, we are working with the Wales TUC on a pilot project to engage young people on the role of trade unions, and I expect to be in a position to announce further detail on this in the coming weeks.

We recognise that there are many campaigns and challenges ahead, from a shorter working week to tackling pay gaps and ensuring workers experience a just transition on net zero, automation and digitalisation. We are committed to working in social partnership to explore what action we can take in these areas. But the UK Government needs to take its responsibilities for employment rights and duties seriously. How many more examples like P&O Ferries do we need to see before the UK Government understands inadequate protections, coupled with weak enforcement and an unwillingness to act is a recipe for a race to the bottom on workers' rights? This Government is doing what we can do, and will always do what we can with the levers we have, but we also need the UK Government to act, and act now.

The rolling back of workers' rights and some of the most restrictive trade union legislation in Europe has gone on for far too long, and we are witnessing the destabilising and devastating consequences of this for our people, communities and economy. We need strong unions to balance the interests of employers and workers. Deputy Llywydd, I make no apologies for continuing to make it clear that joining and being part of a trade union is the best way for any worker to protect their rights at work, improve their pay, terms and conditions and ensure that they are heard and represented.

The Welsh Government will continue to build on the progress we have made, and we'll work with our social partners to advance the fair work agenda in Wales. Diolch.

Thank you, Deputy Minister, for your statement. I think everyone here and across all Governments in the UK would agree that those who receive fair working conditions and fair pay are happier, healthier and probably more productive in their roles, and that we should all be striving to hold Governments to account in order to ensure that everyone has fair working conditions. Whilst those here I'm sure would love to see a perfect system already fully operational, we do have to be mindful that these things take time, and along the way problems will arise that will need to be resolved before any further progress can be made.

I'm glad to hear in your statement today that you're committing to pay the real living wage in the social care sector. I have met with social care groups in my region who are particularly concerned that rates of pay are a major inhibitor to providing consistent care in the adult social care sector, as it is linked to higher staff turnover, where many move to what are ultimately higher paid and less demanding jobs, such as the retail sector. With over 72,000 jobs in the adult social care sector alone, and the fact that most care workers are paid minimum, or close to minimum, wage, this sector represents about a third of the workforce in Wales who earn below the living wage, and I'm sure that implementing the real living wage will go some way along to helping the sector.

I would also like to point out that the social care fair work forum vision statement professes that not only should there be improvements to social care workers' pay, but also there should be improvement in their terms and conditions, and this has not been addressed in your statement. With this in mind, and given the enormous pressure that the sector is under in terms of burn-out and job retention, I would like to ask the Deputy Minister what consideration and assessment has this Government made of other in-work benefits that can contribute to a healthy working environment for social care workers. I think more can be done to provide long-term in-work benefits to those employed in the sector and that improvements would incentivise a greater number of staff to develop careers and help long-term job retention. In particular, I think social care workers could be rewarded with higher pension contributions, larger holiday entitlements or fuel allowances, or even council tax rebates, which could be used as a lever to help better support the lowest paid social care workers, or even encourage workers to stay or move to rural areas.

As the Deputy Minister will be well aware, Wales has the highest median age of all UK nations, and on top of this we have a net influx of retired people from England who wish to live in the Welsh countryside or our coastal villages and towns. With such an ageing population, we need to be diligent in making sure that we have a viable and well-supported social care sector, and I think a better selection of in-work benefits would go a long way in helping people stay in this sector long term.

In terms of fair pay, I want to raise the issue of Cardiff capital region advertising that average wages here are far lower than in other cities in the UK, and Wales's cheap labour is the reason why businesses should look to invest here. The Cardiff capital region have defended this position by saying they are highlighting, in their words, that 'salaries are currently competitive', and it wants to

'leverage further investment to raise wages across the city-region.'

I think that we can all agree that this is an absurd rationality, because if you want to attract business investment, one advertises the high-quality skill set of the workforce, or—and I know that this is a real push for the Welsh Government, given their track record—tries to highlight the quality of infrastructure we have here in Wales. The Deputy Minister may be surprised here, but I agree with the TUC general secretary, Shavanah Taj, in her condemnation of Welsh Government advertising Wales's lowest average wage as

'a depressing and divisive approach which risks locking in a low wage economy for the many communities the CCR leadership represents.'

And I would like to add that what this type of marketing is actually doing is sending a subliminal message to investors that workers in Wales are paid less because they are worth less. It also sends a clear message to those skilled workers who may be looking to come to Cardiff capital region that the Welsh Government values cheap labour. I fully acknowledge, Deputy Minister, that you were probably unaware of this marketing brochure, and that it's not representative of the wider Welsh marketing strategy. However, it does go some way in showing the thinking that underpins the Welsh Government's overall approach, and we need to recognise that information like this will stay in the public domain. Whilst you might argue that, in the grand scheme of things, this is somewhat minor, I would argue that we will never fully realise the damage this type of action causes long term. I therefore ask the Deputy Minister how you intend to enforce better marketing strategies that will actually reflect the quality and diverse skill set of workers in Wales, given the fact that you have accepted a recommendation to ensure fair work is the responsibility of all Welsh Ministers and officials. How will this Government now ensure that the principles of fair work that are being proclaimed by this Government are actually included in future investor marketing material?

Finally, I want to bring up the point of reporting your annual progress. You have mentioned the real living wage, and of course your shameless sales pitch for your trade union supervisors, and the Deputy Minister's disappointing politicisation of P&O workers in this statement, where there has been widespread condemnation from the UK Government over this action and they are doing everything they can to help those workers. You have decided to talk about these issues at the expense of some of the most vulnerable in society, who I'm sure would have welcomed even a glancing mention. I wonder why you—

You need to conclude now, please.

Okay, only a couple of final sentences. I wonder why you haven't mentioned any progress for fair work for disabled people, why you haven't mentioned any progress to remove and reduce barriers that disabled people are presented with, and I wonder why you haven't mentioned any initiatives to help close the disability employment gap. With this in mind, can the Deputy Minister tell this Chamber what proposals this Government has to help disabled people access a fair working environment? Because as a disproportionately affected group, they should be a priority for this Government. Thank you.

This Welsh Government's position is clear: we're very much committed to Wales being a nation of fair work and do not believe you should promote low wages as a reason for investing. And I do welcome the start of the Member's contribution, with his constructive suggestions around the work we're doing in the social care sector and the real living wage, but I note that, towards the end, he managed to, from a previous contribution, downgrade my trade union colleagues from being my trade union bosses to now being my trade union supervisors. But I'm sure Shavanah Taj would be delighted that Joel James agrees with her on one thing.

But, in all seriousness, I think the point you raised at the start, Joel, around things taking time and there are problems along the way—. And I think that's one of the values of our social partnership working, not just with trade unions, but with employers from the public, private and voluntary sectors, bringing in people with that lived experience and expertise in different areas we're seeking to address and to move forward and develop a whole package around fair pay, which, you're absolutely right, is not just about your take-home pay; it's about the broader well-being and conditions around your work as well. Social partnership does enable us to do that, and it enabled us to do it during the pandemic, when we were able to come together as the health and safety forum, addressing the things around workplace risk assessments, and then they were implemented, and then we had a forum to come back to and say, 'Well, actually these things need tweaking for them to be much more effective in practice and to serve the purpose that they were intended to do.'

On the points around the real living wage in social care, in my statement I did indicate that the real living wage was a starting point to immediately address some of those concerns that you highlighted around recruitment and retention as well, and the work programme of the social care fair work forum is now to look at those broader issues that you highlighted around what else could—. Because fair work, like I said, isn't just about your pay as a component part of that; it's about your broader work conditions. And you're absolutely right that we need to get to a position where this sector that we will probably all turn to at some point in our lifetime, and cares very much for our nearest and dearest—to make sure that it has the recognition, status and support that it deserves.  

Thank you for your statement, Deputy Minister. 

It was good to hear your condemnation of the treatment of P&O Ferries staff, who have been treated appallingly. In the absence of much-needed stronger rights for workers, I'm hoping that the resulting public relations disaster will force a rethink for the company bosses. I was also pleased to hear repeated mention of fair work in your statement. As we come out of the pandemic, we must ensure that no-one is left behind. This is a core belief of Plaid Cymru. 

What we have seen in previous recessions and economic downturns is that people at either end of the working-age spectrum have borne the brunt of the crisis. With my responsibility for older people, I'm keen for Wales to learn from the mistakes of the past. For example, during the financial crash of 2008, unemployment amongst older workers almost doubled in the UK. We know that, when older people are made redundant, they find it harder to find work. Without adequate support, we run the risk of an entire generation of older people, in their 50s and 60s, not finding another job before reaching state pension age. What compounds matters is that many older people face ageism and age discrimination in the workplace. I would therefore like to hear from the Deputy Minister today about how they intend to remedy these concerns.

I also wish to raise a matter mentioned by my party colleague, Luke Fletcher, during Plenary last week. Many of my constituents commute to Cardiff from their towns and villages, so I was dismayed to see the Cardiff capital region marketing the area as a haven for employers that pay lower wages. This contradicts the work of the Fair Work Commission to promote the policy that fair work equals fair reward. We should be seeking to remedy wage disparity and not boast about it in prospectuses to companies, thus perpetuating the inequalities that exist within Wales. This is particularly galling during a cost-of-living crisis that has plunged many families into stark poverty. Will you therefore condemn the advertising from the Cardiff capital region? I note your answer to a previous question, but how do you intend to address the perception that it's okay for businesses to come to Wales and pay workers a lower wage? Diolch yn fawr. 

Diolch yn fawr, Peredur, for your question. If I touch on the last point first, and reiterate what I said to Joel James, our position as a Welsh Government is clear: we do not believe we should promote low wages as a reason for investing in Wales. I was disappointed by the approach that Cardiff capital region took in emphasising lower rates of graduate pay relative to some parts of the UK. I understand that the region has now clarified its position and its aspiration to raise wages and the quality of work across the region, but I very much reaffirm that the Welsh Government is committed to working with our partners to make sure that fair work is embedded and promoted across everything we do, as recommended by the Fair Work Commission's report.

If I turn to some of the points you made very eloquently, and your very valuable points around the challenges for people at each end of the working age spectrum, shall we say, in terms of actually where we are in, perhaps, the more pressurised economic circumstances. As part of our recent employability and skills strategy, myself and other Ministers across Government—particularly my colleague the Minister for Social Justice—have worked very closely with colleagues such as the Minister for Economy and colleagues across economy, social partnership and fair work to make sure that not only is fair work embedded as part of this, and is considered as part of it, but, actually, that those considerations you raised are mainstreamed across everything we do, and that it takes into consideration, too, those kinds of challenges around intersectionalities, not just for older people, but women, people from minority ethnic backgrounds, too. So, it's very much something that's at the heart of what we do, and I'm more than happy to pick that up with the Member outside of the statement today, just to take up some of the questions you raised. 

One of the things we've been looking at, too, is in terms of how we can use those levers, particularly within the public sector, where we do have more leverage because of where our devolved responsibility lies. It's something that I worked on in a previous role in a previous life as well, as we say, and that's, actually, the value that older people can bring to the workplace in terms of passing on their skills. So, looking at opportunities for things like phased retirement and reducing their hours at a phased rate, and actually being able to then work with younger people to help upskill and then transfer their skills as part of those training and apprenticeship opportunities. So, there are plans there and there's work done, and as I always say, there's much more to do, but like I said, I'm more than happy to engage with the Member about how we can work collaboratively on this.

I welcome the statement by the Minister on devolved public services, and can I join with others in welcoming the living wage in social care? But, will the Minister commit to no exploitative contracts and everyone to be paid at least the real living wage in all devolved Welsh public services? Will the Welsh Government use its procurement powers to exclude from Welsh Government-funded contracts companies paying less than the real living wage, or using exploitative contracts? Finally, will the Minister join me in condemning fire and rehire, and will companies that use that be banned from Welsh Government-funded contracts? And listening to what people have said about low pay, if low pay was important for investment and growth, explain to me Palo Alto, explain to me New York, explain to me Mannheim, explain to me Cambridge. It's the high-paid areas that are the ones who are getting the investment, not the low-paid ones.

I thank Mike Hedges for his very passionate contribution, and I know this is an area that Mike has campaigned on and articulated in this Chamber for a number of years. The short answer to your question around whether I would condemn fire and rehire is 'yes'. We're absolutely committed to using all the levers we can to go as far as we can to make sure that, actually, that practice is not being used in Wales. But, of course, we need that legislation at a UK level and that employment Bill that was promised in 2019 still hasn't been introduced. As I said in my statement, how long can we go on having some of the most restrictive and limited protections for workers in the whole of Europe, and examples like P&O and other—? It's been brought into much sharper focus, I think, in the past six months during the pandemic, and more people are aware of the consequences of tactics like fire and rehire because, actually, our current structure allows that to happen. So, absolutely, I condemn it and it needs to be outlawed, and people in work need greater protections wherever they work across the UK.

On outsourcing, the key point is that outsourcing is not used to erode terms and conditions, as a means, shall I say, to paraphrase, to level down. Organisations that will be captured by our social partnership and public procurement Bill will need to approach these issues in ways that are consistent with the socially responsible procurement duties. We're also seeking to strengthen the code of practice and ethical procurement alongside that, and actually the procurement duties within the Bill, we'll also look at applying to supply chains as well. So, we're looking at all those levers we have in Wales to make a difference in the areas that Mike Hedges raised, as well as and alongside our programme for government commitment to make sure that we explore where services can be sustainably and affordably be brought back into a strengthened public sector, we will do.

Sticking with P&O, step forward the company that actually employs people with different working conditions in the shipping industry; as far as I'm aware, they're all using offshore places to register their companies, and they're all paying really appalling wages, and the conditions that they house these people in are really quite dreadful. But there's very little that Welsh Government can do, not even collaborating with the UK Government. This is an international problem that has to be dealt with by the United Nations.

Sticking with what we can do something about, you mentioned that one of the levers the Welsh Government has to support individuals and organisations is to upskill them, so they can access fair work. So, I wanted to look at the areas of the economy where we know there are recruitment and retention challenges. The Welsh Government is investing a large sum of money in extending the real living wage to social care and childcare, as well as obviously investing many millions in the optimised retrofit programme. How and who are you upskilling people who are under-represented in those sectors, whether they're ethnic minorities or more men in childcare, more women as insulation fitters in the construction industry?

I thank Jenny Rathbone for her contribution and for raising and flagging the challenges that we do face in both a national and an international setting, because, obviously, the legal protections are not there and are definitely not strong enough to protect workers in workplaces right across the UK and beyond.

In terms of what we can do, you're right to identify those areas where we can support and upskill and use those levers at our disposal to try and make as much of a difference and an impact on people's lives that we can, in communities right across the country. So, again, we're working in social partnership, making sure we're working with people who can bring not just experience of the employment sector and the challenges that they face, but also in terms of the lived experience of people that work within those sectors too, and also the lived experience of people that we want to actually upskill, at the same time as supporting the sectors to strengthen them and strengthen the status and ensure that there are broader opportunities.

So, we are working with our social partners to ensure that employers and trade unions act as the champions for that change, to really drive forward, to help us to spread awareness and practice and to transform those organisational cultures to bring people on, working proactively to promote the advantages of a diverse workforce, and making sure that the work environments are there that are inclusive and support ethnic minority workers to participate, and not just to participate, but to progress and thrive as well, which I think is all important.

And alongside that, we are improving our front-line employability and skills services, ensuring that they are properly inclusive and are reflective of the communities they serve, which is as it should be, and taking action to widen participation of ethnic minority groups in the skills system. I know we're working right across Government with my colleague Jane Hutt in terms of the anti-racist action plan we're looking at now and other action plans around disabled workers and the LGBTQ+ community as well, to make sure that we're thinking about things in the workplace as well as in the community too, to make sure that's embedded across Government and through our employability and skills strategies moving forward as well.

Finally, Jack Sargeant.

Diolch yn fawr, Deputy Presiding Officer. Could I commend the Minister for the work she has done in this area, not just as a Minister or Member of the Senedd, but of course in her previous role as a trade unionist? And I put on record my proud membership of Unite the Union, a community union, here today.

I did listen with interest when you mentioned a shorter working week in your statement. Perhaps it's time for a wider conversation on that, and of course the Petitions Committee will be undertaking an inquiry into that, and we would certainly like to hear your views around that. But I want to raise the example that I raised last week in the Chamber, where a young woman, working in the hospitality sector told me, and again, I quote, that she would get more tips if she didn't wear a mask. I simply can't comprehend this. Who on earth thinks that's an acceptable thing to say? It's an absolute disgrace.

So, Minister, 'How do we empower young workers?' is my question. I, of course, know many of these powers do sit with the UK Government and colleagues will be well aware today, I'm sure, of my feelings towards the competence of the UK Conservative Government in this field, but having said that, what can we do, working with the powers we do have in Welsh Government, working with our trade union colleagues, to ensure that young workers are empowered and protected?

The Llywydd (Elin Jones) took the Chair.

I thank my colleague Jack Sargeant for his contribution and for the work he is doing around supporting and amplifying the voice of young workers, which is really important. Can I absolutely join with you in condemning the experience of that young woman worker and what she's faced in the workplace? But I think, unfortunately, all of us here will say that's probably not atypical; that's probably an all-too-common experience. And what I've found, not just in this role, but as you've said previously, that, anecdotally, young workers are probably the most likely to be exploited because they don't know their rights.

So, I think for us as a Welsh Government, one of the things we can do is actually how we link in to the work we're doing with Careers Wales, which we're doing for the employability and skills plan, and other Welsh Government-supported organisations and bodies, that we're making sure that people, particularly young workers, are able to access information about rights and responsibilities in the workplace, and also the support that being a part of a trade union can give you. And I allude to it in the statement that we want to do some work, working with the pilot project with the Wales TUC, to actually reach out to younger workers, young people in schools, actually, to talk to them about their rights and responsibilities, and the role that trade unions play in workplaces and communities in Wales. I do remember writing something many years ago about why you should join a trade union. Don't we, Joel? Joel, I'll bring you a membership form to join a trade union next time. But in all seriousness, you spend such a significant part of your adult life in work, unless you win the lottery or gain money through spurious means, it's so, so important that you know your rights and protections and the best way to do that is being part of a trade union.

I thank the Deputy Minister.