The next item, therefore, is item 3, a statement by the Deputy Minister for Social Partnership on the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Bill. And I call on the Deputy Minister to make that statement—Hannah Blythyn.

Thank you, Llywydd. On behalf of the Welsh Government, it's a pleasure to present the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Bill today. In doing so, I'd like to thank all our social partners—employers in the public and private sectors, and the trade unions in Wales—for all of their contributions to the work of developing this important legislation.

The Deputy Presiding Officer (David Rees) took the Chair.

The Bill fulfills a key programme for government commitment to place social partnership on a statutory footing in Wales. It provides for a framework to enhance the well-being of the people of Wales, including by improving public services and through social partnership working, promoting fair work and carrying out socially responsible public procurement. 

The Bill establishes a social partnership council for Wales, bringing together Government, employers and worker representatives nominated by the Wales Trades Union Congress. The function of the council will be to provide information and advice to the Welsh Ministers in relation to the social partnership duties, the pursuit of the 'a prosperous Wales' well-being goal by public bodies and the socially responsible public procurement duties. The legislation also provides for a public procurement sub-group of the social partnership council to be established.

The Bill places a new social partnership duty on certain public bodies and on Welsh Ministers. Certain public bodies will be required to seek consensus or compromise with their recognised trade unions, or, where there is no recognised trade union, other representatives of their staff, when setting their well-being objectives and delivering on those objectives under section 3(2) of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015. This duty goes beyond a simple requirement to consult. Through it, we expect public bodies to be actively engaged with their recognised trade unions or other staff representatives as genuine partners in the setting and pursuit of their well-being objectives. Welsh Ministers will be placed under a separate duty to consult social partners, employers and worker representatives through the social partnership council when delivering on their well-being objectives under section 3(2)(b) of the 2015 Act.

The Bill amends section 4 of the well-being of future generations Act by replacing 'decent work' with 'fair work' within the existing 'a prosperous Wales' goal. Back in 2018, the Welsh Government established the Fair Work Commission to make recommendations to promote and encourage fair work. The commission’s report, 'Fair Work Wales', published in 2019, recommended that the actions by public bodies under the 2015 Act should incorporate fair work. 

The Bill also creates a duty for socially responsible public procurement. Almost £7 billion of public money is spent each year through procurement in Wales. Under the new duty, specified public bodies will be required to consider socially responsible public procurement when carrying out procurement, to set objectives in relation to well-being goals, and to publish a procurement strategy. Public bodies will also be required to carry out contract management duties to ensure that socially responsible outcomes are pursued through supply chains. Finally, the Bill imposes reporting duties on the relevant public bodies and Welsh Ministers in relation to the social partnership duty and socially responsible procurement duty.

As I said in my statement to the Senedd on 14 September last year, this Bill has been the subject of extensive consultation. Crucially, it has also been prepared in collaboration with our social partners. Through their help, wise counsel and occasional challenge, I am confident the Bill presented to the Senedd today is an ambitious yet practical step forward for social partnership in Wales, which will contribute significantly to the achievement of our well-being goals.

Social partnership is not new and is certainly not unique to Wales. However, social partnership has evolved to become a Welsh way of working and, over the course of the last two years, this way of working has demonstrated very clear benefits for workers, employers and Government alike, as together we sought to manage the impact of the COVID pandemic and to keep the people of Wales safe.

Welsh Government has a long-standing commitment to this way of working, and we want to futureproof social partnership to ensure future generations can benefit not only from better well-being, but also from strong, sustainable public services underpinned by a social partnership approach. The framework established by the Bill will help social partners work better together in pursuit of the well-being goals contained within the well-being of future generations Act.

The Bill aims to make Wales a better, fairer, more prosperous place to live and work. The mechanisms in the Bill are intended to help unite Government, workers and public services in Wales towards a common vision—that of a prosperous, resilient, healthier, more equal Wales with cohesive communities, vibrant culture, thriving Welsh language, and a globally responsible Wales.

The Bill builds on the already extensive history and success of social partnership working in Wales. I'm committed to continuing to work in social partnership as this legislation progresses, and I look forward to further discussions with Plaid Cymru, as part of the co-operation agreement, on how we can maximise the impact of this new legislation.

In closing, Dirprwy Lywydd, I very much look forward to the contributions of Senedd Members both today and in taking forward the Social Partnership and Public Procurement (Wales) Bill.

Thank you, Deputy Minister, for your statement and for the introduction of this Bill. However, despite your efforts, I do believe that there are overwhelming points of issue with it. Firstly, the social partnership council that is being proposed is likely to just consolidate existing social partnership mechanisms on a statutory basis, thus endorsing the status quo and removing the impetus to improve fair work through supply chains.

Secondly, there is existing legal duty on public bodies to protect people from discrimination in the workplace and in the wider society, as laid out in the Equality Act 2010, and so what this Bill will simply do is increase the regulatory burden on public bodies. This will be problematic, because public bodies in Wales are, in all likelihood, going to struggle with implementing additional regulation. We have heard in this Chamber that 5 per cent of public bodies still claim to have never heard of this Government's flagship policy of the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015, and many more have struggled to fulfil its requirements. So, I ask the Deputy Minister why this Government believes that this Bill will improve public body procurement, when public bodies, with the help of this Government and the commissioner, cannot fully implement regulation that has been in place for nearly 10 years.   

Thirdly, I believe that there is insufficient quantifiable evidence that this Bill will bring any significant benefits to fair work in supply chains, because it is grounded entirely in the faith that there will be a positive impact. As you know, Deputy Minister, previous efforts to increase the social impact of procurement, such as the European social fund project, revealed no tangible evidence of positive results to either local economies or fair work practices. Dirprwy Lywydd, the best-case scenario that this Bill can hope for is that public procurement contracts ensure fair work practices in those areas where goods and services are at present being procured, which is a rather limited exercise since public bodies already have the means to do this, and, for the most part, they already do it. Furthermore, this Bill will not be able to address unfair working practices in areas outside of public supply chains, which is where most of the support is needed. 

So, I wonder, Dirprwy Lywydd, what is the real purpose of introducing such a Bill. I believe that this Government's purpose for the Bill is to increase the power of trade unions by giving them an equal say over public procurement contracts, which is a dangerous scenario to be in, because it will mean that trade unions will now be able to withhold or slow down public procurement at their discretion and effectively hold public bodies to ransom by stopping consultation on procurement contracts until their demands are met. This will be challenging for public bodies during disputes, as trade unions will now have even more leverage to stop public bodies from functioning. 

On another point, we must be mindful that trade unions are not infallible to corruption. As we know, Unite, the Labour Party's biggest supporter, has employees being investigated for bribery, fraud and money laundering, and current investigations have recently seen Unite properties, including the headquarters, raided by several police forces. Dirprwy Lywydd, it is not a hyperbole to say that this Government's Bill could see corrupt trade union officials receiving funds from prospective suppliers to manipulate favourable places ahead of the queue for public procurement contracts, as well as being able to bully and coerce suppliers into meeting their own specific demands, putting suppliers' backs up against the wall with threats of losing contracts if they do not comply. It could even create the scenario that trade unions may receive generous campaign contributions from prospective companies looking to secure lucrative public procurement contracts. 

Thirdly, because trade unions are now going to have to scrutinise public procurement chains, it will mean more than just facility time payments will be needed. Trade unions will need personnel who are properly trained, and their time will need to be appropriately paid for, because, Deputy Minister, you cannot expect trade unions to scrutinise fair work and fair pay practices without themselves receiving fair pay in return. So, undoubtedly, trade unions have to receive, at some point, public money to carry out these regulatory duties. And, for those Members of Plaid Cymru looking to support this Bill, you need to be very much aware that this Bill will ultimately be ploughing public money into trade union coffers, who will then be donating more money to the Labour Party, which is certainly a conflict of interest.

Surely, Deputy Minister, it is glaringly obvious that an independent body that can hire the best people without political affiliation, and that does not pay contributions to the Labour Party, would be much better placed to scrutinise contracts to ensure fair pay and fair work conditions. They can then report back to Government and public bodies and the appropriate decisions can then be made. I argue that, given all the points I have made, there is very little ground for trade unions to take on this role within the public procurement contracts. In conclusion, I'd like to say that ensuring fair work throughout supply chains is an immensely positive step. However, the current system already allows for that. Legislation from this Government already places a duty on public bodies to review proper working conditions and fair pay through the supply chains. So, ultimately, this Bill comes about from the mistrust of this Government towards public bodies and their ability to effectively review their own supply chains, and a desire by the Labour Party to give trade unions a suffocating grip on public procurement in Wales. [Interruption.] 

Before I ask the Minister to answer any questions that may have been in that, please remember that this is a statement and not a debate at this point in time. I have a request for a point of order from Jack Sargeant.

Thank you, Deputy Presiding Officer. I'm very grateful for the opportunity to raise this point of order, and I would ask the Welsh Conservative spokesperson to reflect on the language he has used during his contribution this afternoon with regard to trade unions and Welsh trade unions, based on no evidence—very disrespectful and distasteful comments around corruption in Welsh trade unions. And as a proud member of a Welsh trade union—two of them, in fact—and I'm speaking on behalf of the residents of Wales, not just Members of the Senedd, I'd ask the Member to withdraw those comments. 

I'm not clear whether that's a point of order, but you've made your statement quite clear at this point. Hannah Blythyn. 

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I will try my best to address some of the more substantive contributions from the Member there, given this is a significant and landmark piece of legislation, and it should be treated with respect as such. However, I would say, once again, the Member does, at best, misunderstand the intent of the legislation, not least the content, but seeks to deliberately misrepresent it as well for his own political ends. And I extend the invitation, as we do to all Members, to a further technical briefing as part of this legislation. And I would be more than happy to sit down with the Member myself to go through the legislation in detail to address some of the points that he has made today, to give him reassurance and to make clear that, actually, what we are doing is about giving equal voice and equal weight—actually making sure that we strengthen fair work in Wales.

On the point that the Member made towards the end, I've taken that as, 'Fair work is great, as long as workers who are impacted by that aren't given an opportunity to shape that or have a voice'. So, what this legislation seeks to do is to underpin that social partnership work that we already have, to put it on a formal footing, and, actually, to give us that greater connectivity and consistency of approach so that we can be as effective as we possibly can, and to strengthen that with the legislative underpinning, but also through the social partnership duty on public bodies. And many good employers, not just public bodies, already work in social partnership, and what this does is just strengthen that and gives them the support and opportunity to do that as well. 

In terms of procurement, successive reviews of procurement in Wales have actually shown that we need to legislate in order to make good practice and make progress, and deliver well-being outcomes through procurement and make it more consistent. This legislation is responding to those reviews in terms of how we need to build on that and improve in the future. 

Just one final point to pick up what the Member said, to address the points he made around supply chains, actually, the contract management duties in this legislation seek to strengthen that around supply chains, particularly within, for instance, the construction sector, where we know there are significant challenges in terms of the way in which the sector works and the length and complexity of the supply chains, and also in terms of how we ensure we strengthen the statutory code of practice when it comes to the outsourcing of any public services. 

Thank you very much for the update today, Minister. There are elements within the draft that we welcome, and we look forward to the opportunity to influence its impact, as referenced by the Minister's statement.

Since 2012, Plaid Cymru has continually called for increased public procurement. We want to increase Welsh firms' share of contracts from 52 per cent to 75 per cent of the public procurement budget. It's estimated that this would create 46,000 additional jobs, and safeguard many existing jobs in the Welsh economy. That's a potential benefit that would be transformational for our local economy, our local businesses and our local communities. So, my first question is: how may the Bill be used to drive up public procurement from Welsh companies and businesses as part of supporting the Welsh economy, for example through exploring the use of targets?

I note from the consultation responses released earlier this year that several issues of concern were raised by key partners. The Bevan Foundation raised a number of important points during their consultation response, including the need to address the wider labour market context in which the social partnership Bill will operate. On fair work, they stated that the proposed processes seem very cumbersome and that there was a risk that processes consume too many resources—resources that could be better directed to achieving change on the ground.

Consultation responders such as the Trades Union Congress also raised concerns over the clarity of the definition and principle of social partnership, and suggested that the definition could be strengthened to acknowledge that while it is important that social partners recognise and respect each other's interests, it's also important that each other's mandates and respective areas of expertise are recognised and respected. How have these points been addressed since the publication of the consultation responses, and, in particular, how have they been incorporated into the Bill?

An emphasis on fair work, or, as you have newly defined it, decent work, has become even more salient amid a climate of poor working conditions in recent years. In 2019 and 2020, we saw Cardiff University staff take strike action over pay and working conditions. In September 2021, after heroism throughout the pandemic, workers in the NHS pushed unions to get behind their demand for a 15 per cent pay rise. And last November, bus drivers in Blackwood, Brynmawr and Cwmbran underwent strike action against low pay and cuts to basic terms and conditions. Could you please set out how the Bill would have helped workers in those situations and what it means for groups considering taking strike action?

Finally, Deputy Minister, this Government has suggested on multiple occasions that it intends to tackle the climate emergency in a holistic manner. The TUC made a suggestion that a commitment on green recovery could be made through this Bill by addressing the skills pipeline issues. This could be done by working with unions and others to identify how workers in impacted sectors could adapt their existing skills, whilst also creating new jobs for those who have lost their job in the pandemic. This could transform the retrofitting industry, for example. Is this Bill meeting this potential? Seeing as it seeks to align closely with the well-being of future generations Act, how is it meeting the environmental well-being of Wales? Diolch yn fawr.

Diolch. Can I thank the Member for his contribution and the commitment from Plaid Cymru to actually work with us? This Bill proposes to harness the power of public procurement and the broader benefits it can bring, because the measures outlined in the Bill seek to leverage the power of the public purse to pursue, and deliver more importantly, outcomes that are beneficial, more broadly, to our communities, to our economy and to our environment. The way we carry out our procurement and commissioning, and the rigour with which we actually manage that—those commercial arrangements in particular, and the supply chains—have a direct impact on fair work, but also other well-being outcomes in Wales and further afield. This legislation provides the opportunity to go further in delivering those well-being goals for procurement, and that's why we've chosen to include those broader well-being goals as part of the legislation as well as simply fair work.

Those procurement duties about contributing to environmental, social, economic and cultural well-being—. Apart from the contract management duties, the Bill contains no further details about expectations in these categories, and I think that's why there is a real opportunity here to work together in developing statutory guidance that sets out how public bodies should set out those socially responsible procurement objectives and what should be included in that procurement, such as in annual reports and, importantly, to get that data to include the data that we need to be collecting and reporting in order to actually better meet those objectives that the Member and colleagues on the Plaid Cymru benches have, as you said, been raising since 2012. We've been developing this Bill for almost as long as that, it feels, some of the time. 

I never thought that I would be stood somewhere saying that procurement is very exciting, but, actually, it does—. You smile knowingly there. This is a framework piece of legislation, but it does bring with it huge opportunities in terms of actually demonstrating what we can do here in Wales, in terms of where we place that social value when it comes to procurement and what we can deliver not just for fair work but, like you say, those broader benefits, whether that's for environmental benefits or, actually, in terms of our communities and actually making sure that we are investing in the Welsh economy and our communities right across the country. 

On the broader points around social partnership generally, we've tried to define, alongside the legislation, what we actually mean by social partnership, and that is working together with a common agenda to provide mutual gains for the benefit of all parties, but alongside the legislation—. The legislation is significant, but it is one part of that process, and alongside this legislation we are conducting a review of social partnership working right across Government and beyond, to give us greater clarity and consistency, and also to recognise the capacity of partners to be part of this process, to make sure that we better engage and better link across it. We've obviously been working very closely with partners such as the Wales TUC and also partners from the employer representatives as well, to make sure that that is done in a way that brings those broader benefits we want to see, and I'd very much welcome conversations with colleagues in the Chamber about actually how we can do that and to be part of that as we move things forward alongside this significant legislation.

I very much welcome the statement from the Minister. Procurement is one of the most powerful tools the Welsh Government has got in order to decide the type of Wales we're going to have. There is a very large procurement programme, not just by the Welsh Government, but by the whole of the Welsh Government-funded public sector, including health and local government. I, like many Members here, am massively opposed to the use of fire and rehire, exploitative contracts, and paying less than the real living wage. Will the Welsh Government use procurement to rule out companies that use fire and rehire, pay less than the real living wage, and use exploitative contracts from all Welsh Government and Welsh Government-funded bodies' contracts, and also, more importantly, the subcontracts? No-one who is getting a penny of money from the Welsh taxpayer should be running companies that are exploiting the workers who are doing the work for them.

I thank Mike Hedges for his contribution. I know this is something—. You demonstrated it then, but I know it's something you've raised time and time again, and, like myself and many others in this Chamber and beyond, feel very passionately about actually how we use all the levers we do have at our devolved disposal in Wales to make a difference when it comes to fair work. Of course, fair work spans both devolved and non-devolved areas, which impacts what we can do and how we can do it. I'm clear that this Bill respects and recognises what we can do in this space.

This is the first piece of legislation on procurement that we have actually developed in Wales, so it will enable us to put existing good practice and socially responsible procurement on a statutory footing but it will also put us in a position to strengthen that as well. As I go back to what I said to previous contributions, the statutory guidance that works on that looks at not just fair work, but the broader well-being objectives too, to get that balance right in terms of things like the foundational economy and fair work, to make sure we are supporting those public bodies too, to actually simplify the process for them in the first instance, but to make sure we get it right in terms of the social value that we want to achieve from it. This Government is absolutely committed to using every lever we do have at our disposal to achieve that.

Just on the point Mike Hedges makes on subcontracting and supply chains, one of the reasons why, in this first instance, the legislation seeks to legislate on the face of the Bill around the construction sector in particular is because, as I said, we know that there will be Members in this Chamber who have been part of those codes of practice we've put in place previously or campaigned for from the outside, around ethical employment in supply chains or umbrella employment opportunities, which we know is something that has been unfortunately all too common within the construction sector. So, this legislation on procurement and contract management seeks to go some way to address that, and also to address actually how that filters down throughout the supply chain as well.

Minister, I very much look forward to scrutinising this Bill at Stage 1 in the Equality and Social Justice Committee. I think it's a very exciting Bill.

I wanted to look at the public procurement aspects, and particularly the reporting duties on public bodies and Welsh Ministers in relation to socially responsible procurement. I just want to query why only socially responsible procurement, because the Well-being of Future Generations (Wales) Act 2015 obviously isn't just about social responsibility. And as public bodies prepare to invest many millions of pounds, quite rightly, in the healthy eating habits of children as we roll out the universal free school meals programme, what role do you expect this Bill to play in ensuring that this particular additional procurement strengthens a prosperous, cohesive and resilient Wales, fundamental to the foundational economy objectives, as well as, of course, making an important contribution to a healthier Wales?

Can I thank Jenny Rathbone for her contribution? I very much look forward to the work that you will do. I welcome what you will do as a committee to quite rightly scrutinise this legislation, but also to work with us as we develop it and move things forward, and I really very much welcome your contributions in terms of recognising the value that this legislation potentially brings, and another person who is excited about procurement as well in the Chamber today.

Just to just try and clarify the point you make around why socially responsible procurement: actually, the Bill sets out duties on the public bodies as specified, which are referred to as 'contracting authorities', so it's called 'socially responsible procurement', but it ensures that when procurement is undertaken, there is consideration of social, economic, cultural and environmental well-being, and there are further duties set out concerning contract management and transparency. So, as I said previously, that's why it's socially responsible procurement and we're talking about well-being and fair work, but it goes broader than that, to capture the points that the Member made there. So, the work will be around the statutory guidance about actually how we can work with Members, work with colleagues across the floor and with our social partners to ensure that we are getting that balance right in terms of actually where that social value is placed and how we can support those public bodies to make sure that we are achieving what we need to achieve. But socially responsible procurement is—. I'm sure it's something we can discuss further when we come to committee, but also in terms of the Member, if it would be helpful, I'm more than happy to write to provide further clarification in terms of what that would encompass, and what the intention is behind that.

And finally, Joyce Watson.

Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. I thank you for the statement today, Deputy Minister, and I want to completely dissociate myself from the comments of Joel James and his anti-trade-union stand, and accusing them of all sorts of unsubstantiated statements. I'm a proud member of a trade union myself.

So, I do welcome this Bill. It is a key component of a wider push to make work in Wales much fairer, and it's a timely intervention too, when Tory taxes, benefit cuts and economic mismanagement are increasingly eroding pay and pensions across the board. And as always, the constructive model of social partnership here in Wales is in direct contrast with the Tories' failed confrontational approach. They're currently picking fights with rail workers as they have with teachers and junior doctors in the past.

So, my question to you, Deputy Minister, is: when we're talking about procurement and social partnerships, which you are here, that we will fully engage with everybody and also, I want to reinforce the question that Mike Hedges asked previously, that anybody that benefits from public funds in Wales both looks after the staff, but more importantly, that we keep the majority of that money here in Wales as well. Thank you.

Can I thank Joyce Watson for the contribution? I know it's something you've particularly been involved with in the past, particularly within the construction sector too, in terms of tackling unjust and unfair work practices, and I know you've worked with both colleagues and me in terms of actually how to take forward codes of practice around this. This legislation seeks to strengthen the work that's gone before by, for the first time, legislating around procurement and how we strengthen not just socially responsible procurement, but going back to what we said previously around using all the levers we do have at our disposal, whilst recognising the constraints of the current devolution settlement, and using the power of the public purse to leverage, particularly in those sectors like construction and also more broadly around socially responsible procurement, which encapsulates fair work as part of that.

I thank the Deputy Minister.