4. Statement by the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution: The Historic Environment (Wales) Bill

Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 4:09 pm on 5 July 2022.

Alert me about debates like this

Photo of Mick Antoniw Mick Antoniw Labour 4:09, 5 July 2022

I thank the Member for those comments, and I look forward to working with all Members, and particularly with the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee who will be scrutinising this particular piece of legislation. Of course, it will not have gone unnoticed that this is not a piece of legislation that is sort of amended in the normal way. That is, the main work will be for the Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee basically to be going through the Bill, to be assessing the Bill, the drafting of the Bill, to be looking at the drafter's notes, and to be satisfied that this is doing what it says on the packet—that it is consolidating, and not reforming. And, of course, the amendments, I would expect—I would hope—are minimal, but may really be of technical nature, but, of course, there is the option of a further amending stage.

The other, I think, point that you started to mention was, of course, that this is innovative, that this process of accessibility is to some extent unique within the United Kingdom, within the four nations. There have been examples of attempted consolidation in the past in areas of law, but what has tended to happen is that that then has been subsequently undermined by a series of legislation that then doesn't amend the consolidated legislation and so on—education, probably, is an example, particularly in England. And, of course, 'codification' means by putting law into categories it will be within that code that the law is amended rather than the creation of a new piece of legislation. So, that requires discipline from this Senedd and a commitment to and understanding of the concept of consolidation. We will, in fact, be the first nation in the UK to actually introduce legislation in this area, and perhaps it's very appropriate that it is in the whole area of the historic environment, which is so important to all of us and to all our communities. 

You mentioned the point of language and specific attention has gone during the drafting of this to using simple language, to using language that is modern and understandable, and that undoubtedly is something that will be scrutinised during the process. And, again, as others have done, I have to commend the lawyers and all the officials that have been involved in this process because this is—. In some ways, when we started looking at this, it was, 'Well, what is a quick win for consolidation?' Well, when you get to 200 pages, you suddenly realise that no legislation is ever really that simple, particularly when you're going back over such a long period of time and looking for explanatory memoranda for legislation that never had explanatory memoranda, where there was never any clear background documentation as to what certain parts of the legislation were actually intended to achieve or what they actually meant.

In terms of the codification timetable, well, to some extent, it's almost a generational thing, isn't it, because we have to deal with an enormous legislative programme in its own right, but as you will know from the statement I made last year, we're looking at three pieces of consolidation. We will be looking to move on beyond that into the next session of the next Senedd with further consolidation. So, this is a process that will go on for quite a number of years. What is important is that we have a consistent commitment from Senedd to Senedd that this is the way we want to restructure the law, to make the law accessible over generations. So, this is not a short-term, over-a-couple-of-years process; this is a generational approach to doing law better, to making it more accessible. And the points you made about accessibility, they're ones we've discussed many times, and I fully agree with them.