The following amendments have been selected: amendment 1 in the name of Lesley Griffiths and amendment 2 in the name of Darren Millar.

The next item is the Plaid Cymru debate, the first this afternoon, on the winter fuel support scheme, and I call on Sioned Williams to move the motion.

Motion NDM8047 Siân Gwenllian

To propose that the Senedd:

Calls on the Welsh Government to revise the winter fuel support scheme to make it fit for purpose in tackling the cost-of-living crisis. 

Motion moved.

Thank you, Dirprwy Lywydd. It's midsummer, and when the clouds rise, it is a time to wear light clothes, T-shirts, to open the windows, sit in the garden, hang the clothes on the line, enjoy a barbecue and to know, usually, that the energy bills won’t be as high as usual, and that the meter won’t spin quite as quickly as the heat of the sun warms our skins and our homes. But this year, the sky is full of black clouds and the long summer days lead not to a feeling of liberation and relaxation, but rather to a period of sadness for too many people. Because the economic storm of the past few months has not eased, and the worst is yet to come.

The impact of the cost-of-living crisis is truly terrifying. The cost of filling the car with petrol or diesel is well over £100 by now. The cost of everyday foods such as pasta is 50 per cent higher, and bread is 17 per cent higher. And energy bills, which are already incredibly high and unaffordable, and which have caused so much anxiety for so many people in Wales, even now in the summer months, are going to climb higher still in the autumn. We need to ensure that any measures to support people who will be living in fuel poverty or who are at risk of fuel poverty are fully effective, fully accessible to those who are or who will be in need, and that they mitigate the serious pressure and the impossible choices that will face too many Welsh households when the storm is raging during the winter months.

We have, of course, welcomed the Government's plans to try to support people who are in the eye of the storm. But our research supports the calls of campaigners who believe that we could review the winter fuel support scheme in order to ensure adequate support for those who need it most, and some of the suggestions to improve the scheme have been outlined in the Conservatives’ amendments.

I would recommend that the Welsh Government ensure that this is a scheme that is available all year round, rather than being a seasonal scheme, to ensure that no-one goes without heat or power during the coldest months. And as I mentioned previously, even though it's summer, there are people now who can't afford to turn on the oven or run a hot bath. We should expand the number of people who are eligible for support, so that everyone who needs support under the scheme can get it, such as those on pension credits, for example. We also need to build a mechanism into the scheme to ensure that it reaches low-income households who pay for their fuel as part of their rental payments, for example. An element of discretion could be introduced into the scheme, so that people who might be on the borderline of eligibility and might miss out, or who find themselves in new or critical situations that push them into poverty, can apply for help.

The Minister has suggested that she agrees that it is necessary to ensure that payments are made before the Ofgem cap is increased in October, and we need a review, therefore, and an evaluation of the previous scheme to ensure that improvements are made before then, to make absolutely sure that payments reach as many eligible households as possible. We need action to improve and harmonise how local authorities engage with needy households and process the claims, alongside an awareness-raising and promotional campaign by the Government. While the Welsh Government has taken positive steps to help people through this cost-of-living crisis, especially compared to the disgraceful and heartless behaviour of the Westminster Government, we must ensure that those steps are thoroughly robust, in order to prevent suffering, the likes of which none of us has seen before. That's the aim of our motion. I encourage Members to support it.

I have selected the two amendments to the motion, and I call on the Minister for Social Justice to formally move amendment 1 tabled in the name of Lesley Griffiths.

Amendment 1—Lesley Griffiths

Delete all and replace with:

To propose that the Senedd:

1. Welcomes the significant support packages introduced by the Welsh Government to help address the cost-of-living crisis, totalling £380m since November 2021, including additional funding for the fuel support scheme for the non-repayable £200 cash payment towards energy bills, and £177m for the cost-of-living support scheme.

2. Notes that the UK Government has entirely failed to properly address this crisis and failed to grasp the gravity of how it is affecting people across Wales.

3. Welcomes the Welsh Government’s commitment to continually review existing fuel support schemes and potential future interventions.

Amendment 1 moved.

Formally.

I call on Mark Isherwood to move amendment 2 tabled in the name of Darren Millar.

Amendment 2—Darren Millar

Add as new point at end of motion:

Further calls on the Welsh Government to:

a) guarantee any changes to the winter fuel support scheme are made ahead of autumn to ensure the payment reaches as many eligible households as possible;

b) widen the eligibility of the winter fuel payment to reach more low-income, vulnerable households in need, such as those eligible for pension credit;

c) launch a public awareness campaign on the winter fuel support scheme to improve awareness and boost uptake of the scheme.

Amendment 2 moved.

I move amendment 2. Fuel poverty is a long-standing social justice issue in Wales, but the recent global energy price increases have brought the issue to the forefront. National Energy Action Cymru have called for the winter fuel support scheme payment to be made in the autumn so households know they have the funds before they turn their heating on. The Minister has previously stated that she would want the payment to be available by October, if not September, hence our amendment, which further calls on the Welsh Government to guarantee any changes to the winter fuel support scheme are made ahead of autumn to ensure the payment reaches as many eligible households as possible. Can the Minister confirm whether this is still her intention?

Age Cymru have called for the Welsh Government to extend eligibility criteria for their winter fuel support scheme to include older people in receipt of pension credit. The Minister previously stated that the Welsh Government were going to extend eligibility and will be looking not just in terms of those on pension credit, but wider eligibility. Hence, our amendment further calls on the Welsh Government to widen the eligibility of the winter fuel payment to reach more low-income, vulnerable households in need, such as those eligible for pension credit. Can the Minister provide an update accordingly?

We understand that by late January there had been relatively low take-up of the scheme, with variation between local authorities. It also needs to be better publicised that off-gas households, using oil or LPG, are eligible for the scheme if they're connected to the electricity grid. Our amendment therefore calls on the Welsh Government to launch a public awareness campaign on the winter fuel support scheme to improve awareness and boost uptake of the scheme.

To keep people as hosts under the Homes for Ukraine Wales scheme, they will also need fuel bill support. However, it's disappointing that the Welsh Government have tried to score political points with their amendment. UK Government support for the cost of living now exceeds £37 billion this year. Almost all of the eight million most vulnerable households will receive at least £1,200. All domestic electricity customers will get at least £400, all of which is now a grant rather than a repayable loan. Pensioner households will receive an extra £300, and around six million people across the UK receiving disability benefits will receive a one-off payment of £150 from September. In that category, as chair of the cross-party group on disability, we are calling for greater help, but nonetheless it's a step in the right direction. Further, from today, around 30 million people will save up to £330 a year on their national insurance contributions. And, of course, the Welsh Government wouldn't have been able to increase its winter fuel scheme without the consequential funding provided by the UK Government. Diolch yn fawr.

We sometimes think that poverty is a conclusive state: you either are poor or you aren't. But, that's not how it works at all. So many people will find their lives tip into chaos over the coming weeks and months, and that isn't scaremongering—it is a categorical fact. Thousands more people will struggle to live—to stay alive—because of monstrously everyday things like food and gas bills. There's something horrible and aberrant about mundane things becoming frightening.

I don't have long in this debate, I know, so I'll keep my points brief. Households eligible for winter fuel payment support need to be told about that support. As we've heard Citizens Advice suggest, we should be contacting people on social tariffs for water or energy, and the Government could use their JIGSO data-sharing arrangement or could encourage Dŵr Cymru to help. I welcome that people on pension credit are eligible for the scheme, though Age Cymru have pointed out that 70,000 eligible households don't claim that credit, and many believe the eligibility criteria is still too rigid.

I'm desperately worried, Dirprwy Lywydd, about those already in debt—the people on prepayment meters who are self-disconnecting already. One Citizens Advice client in south Wales is using a candle for light, and living in one room because of their energy bills. Those everyday horror stories will be repeated in houses all over Wales, behind curtains that are kept closed to keep the heat in, because poverty isn't precise; people's lives don't always fit into tidy boxes that we can say categorically who needs help and when.

Finally, this scheme shouldn't just be for winter. Again, as we've heard, as NEA and others have pointed out, people will need this support the whole year round. Payments should be made as well before the winter bites. Anyone doubting the severity of the impact that the cost-of-living crisis is having should read Age Cymru's 'The Cost of Cold' testimonies, because they're heartbreaking. Geraldine, who's 77, told them, 'Already I wear gloves on my hands at home and a heat pack inside my leggings'. And people of all ages are effected in so many ways. Referrals to food banks by Citizens Advice hit an all-time high in March. What a shameful milestone that is—an all-time high for people living in profound desperation.

So, in closing, Dirprwy Lywydd, I appreciate what the Government is doing, I know that so many causes of these crises are global or outside their control, but some of these things are in the Government's gift. So, please, I'd implore the Minister to listen to the points made in this debate, because every day we don't make these changes is a day that more people will become desperate.

Around 75 per cent of households are expected to be supported in some way by the Welsh Government's cost-of-living interventions, with increased support targeted at households in the bottom half of the income distribution. We know the winter fuel support payment is valued by people who received it and one recipient in my region of North Wales said, 'the £100 alleviated my poverty for this month and will also keep me warm for at least a month and a bit. Another £100'—which was given—'will mean I can keep warm in March, April and up to mid May. It made such a difference.'

We do face very serious challenges. UK household incomes fell for a fourth consecutive quarter at the start of this year, making the longest run of decline since 1955, and it's now estimated that up to 45 per cent of all households in Wales could be in fuel poverty, and more than 100,000 of those in severe fuel poverty. Citizens Advice expressed to me how fuel voucher schemes provided a crucial lifeline to those in crisis situations. The Welsh Government has ensured vital funding is available in the form of the fuel voucher scheme and the discretionary assistance fund to support these families in these situations, and it's gratefully received.

The Welsh Government is doing what it can to support those in need, but, fundamentally, the people of Wales have been let down by the Tory UK Government, which has failed to act to stop astronomical energy prices. To make matters worse, the welfare system, as it stands, is entirely unfit for purpose, and universal credit fails to protect families. Years of fiscal restraint has stretched our public services and eroded public and private sector workers' pay in the name of productivity. But that productivity has not increased wages and living standards.

Grants are a sticking plaster, can be bureaucratic, not reach everyone in need, and don't address the fundamental problems people are facing. I noticed that Flintshire County Council were advertising for 10 new benefits officers, but those are on £19,200 each. They could be going to foodbanks before long as well. It's just increasing all the time. Action needs to be taken now to put money in people's pockets, at the fuel pumps, and in their pay packets.

One concern I would like to raise with the Minister, however, is that many tenants are forced to use private prepayment meters, which are excluded from Ofgem's maximum-price regulations. Energy is resold by the landlord to tenants, with the landlord able to pass on a daily standing charge to the tenant. This further entrenches a poverty premium that is applied to those using prepayment meters, many of whom have no choice in the matter. As it is within the competency of the Welsh Government to end this practice, I wonder if the Minister could comment on the practice, please, in her response to the debate, and outline if the Welsh Government has any plans to address this, if at all possible. Thank you.

The Welsh Government's winter fuel support scheme sets out to support those most vulnerable, and it's valued by those who receive it, as Carolyn pointed out. But my concern lies with those that don't receive it. My constituent Michelle is a disabled full-time unpaid carer for her disabled husband. They depend on their personal independence payments and her carers allowance to survive. As she recently discovered, she was not eligible for the winter fuel support scheme because she isn't claiming a qualifying UK-administered means-tested benefit. Why are we choosing to rely on the notoriously heartless DWP system to dictate to us who is eligible for the winter fuel support scheme, when we often regret how little control we have over our own welfare system? Are we really denying this support to someone who is experiencing such crippling poverty that they must choose between food and fuel? It should not shock the Siambr at all to know that many people experiencing poverty may not be able to access the usual means-tested benefits. Through the eligibility criteria we've chosen for the winter fuel support scheme, we are at risk of simply operating like a welfare delivery department for the DWP, with the DWP de facto telling us who is eligible for support.

We must take the initiative here in this Senedd to ensure that all those who need our support get it. We have the power to do that with the winter fuel support scheme by expanding the eligibility criteria. Potentially we could even add a discretionary element to the fund for those who just miss the eligibility criteria. In Michelle's instance, I was directed to inform her that the discretionary assistance fund was available for emergencies where she would need to preferably make a new claim for each different emergency. It's welcome that the fund is there, but I would ask: which emergency should Michelle claim for? Her inability to light her home every day? Her lack of hot water? Those in poverty experience emergencies like these every day. As we approach winter this year, we must ensure that this vital scheme is fit for purpose. People like Michelle and her husband need the financial lift that the winter fuel support scheme provides. Let's not only change the eligibility criteria so that we can help those most vulnerable through this cost-of-living crisis, but ensure that payments are regular and timely throughout the year, so that support is always available. Because, God knows, Michelle and others need it. 

I call on the Minister for Social Justice, Jane Hutt. 

Diolch yn fawr. I'd like to thank Plaid Cymru for bringing this important debate today, and it's very timely. I thank Members across the Chamber for their contributions. I will be making an announcement within the next fortnight on the new fuel support scheme. It's going to be a fuel support scheme—not a winter fuel support scheme, but a new Welsh fuel support scheme, learning from the scheme that we've already progressed over the last year, which actually—as Carolyn Thomas says, that £200 had made such a difference to so many people's lives. And also, what I will be announcing in the next fortnight is the wider eligibility criteria for the new fuel support scheme, and it will open in the autumn. So, this is important, that all of the engagement and the consultation that has taken place is influencing the next phase. 

Will the Minister take an intervention? 

I just wondered if I could ask you about what the take-up was of the original scheme. Because you talked about the 350,000 people or householders who were eligible, and the Minister for Finance referred to 200,000 households that had taken it up. Are we talking the same numbers of people, or could you clarify how many people you thought were eligible and actually were able to be made aware of their eligibility?

The Llywydd took the Chair.

Thank you very much for that question. We weren't sure how many would be eligible—we're very much dependent on DWP data and information about that. As you recall, we actually created this to very much follow the cut to the £20 of universal credit, so we were looking, very initially, at working families, and that's why we now need to widen it beyond that. But the take-up was reaching the 200,000 mark. I'll certainly give more indication of that, a clear indication of that, when we get the final response from our local authorities, who actually did deliver this scheme for us. I met with the partnership council, with the Minister for Finance and Local Government this morning, not only to thank them for the delivery of the winter fuel support scheme, but to forewarn them that we would now expect them to deliver this. And of course the take-up of it, the publicity, the awareness of it, is crucially important, as has been said. 

Now, we've been through the context—since Ofgem increased the energy price cap by 54 per cent in April, our analysis has shown that the number of households living in fuel poverty in Wales rose from 12 per cent in 2018 to an estimated 45 per cent. And the planned increase in energy prices in October, of course, will further exacerbate the financial problems that households are experiencing. We held a cost-of-living summit in February, and I'm holding a follow-up event on Monday, but also meeting the disability equality forum, Wales race forum, as well as the cross-party group, of course, chaired by Mark Isherwood, just to understand the impact of the crisis on the ground and develop informed solutions to guide us, because this is about building the resilience of vulnerable households at this time. 

So, the feedback has helped to inform the development of this further fuel support scheme for Wales, how it can reach more households so that more people can receive the £200, which offers such crucial support, but widening its eligibility. But I will say that the fuel support scheme is just one suite of initiatives to support people who are struggling to meet the increased cost of their energy bills. And I'm very glad that reference has been made to the announcement I made of our partnership now with the Fuel Bank Foundation—nearly £4 million of funding, on 10 June we announced that, for the national fuel voucher and heat fund scheme in Wales. So, that's also going to provide direct financial support to eligible households that prepay for their fuel—those with pre-payment meters, those not connected to the mains gas network who are struggling to prepay for their fuel.

I will follow up those points and questions that have been raised today about the eligibility and the impacts in terms of landlords and the standing charges, which actually have risen highest in north Wales. And I did announce this at Wrexham foodbank, because I know how this was hitting households in rural areas and in north Wales in particular in terms of those standing charges. But also, that money is going to fund the expansion of the partner network to support wraparound energy and savings advice. This is, again, and we've discussed this in response to questions in my oral questions earlier on, actually about enabling the message to get out, the support to be given, every contact that's made, but also the additional funding to ensure our discretionary assistance fund can provide that support throughout the summer and the winter. We've agreed that to the end of March next year for people who are unable to afford, for example, their next delivery of oil or liquid petroleum gas due to extreme financial hardship. So, these initiatives are delivering alongside our £150 cost-of-living payment, our £25 million discretionary fund for local authorities, our Warm Homes programme and 'Claim what's yours'.

Now, just finally, Llywydd, my reason for amending the motion was to ensure that this debate recognises that the main levers for addressing this fuel crisis do sit with the UK Government, and I do thank Sioned Williams for acknowledging this as well. It was the UK Government's reluctance to act early on this that compounded the impact of fuel price rises. Even now, despite the evidence of the impact it's having, there remain gaps in the support that they've offered. So, I've already responded, earlier on today, to say that we call for the removal of all social environmental policy costs from household energy bills, for those costs to be met from general taxation and to introduce a lower price cap for lower income households to ensure that they can also meet their energy bills. But we also need to increase local housing allowance rates, to increase funding for discretionary housing payments to prevent a significant number more people becoming homeless as a result of rent arrears. So, I hope Members will consider supporting this amendment—not only the Welsh Government's commitment to address the cost-of-living crisis, but also it's the duty of the UK Government to do so much more with their powers and responsibilities, which they're failing to do. But our scheme will be announced and it's responded to so many of the issues that have been raised today. Diolch yn fawr. 

Mabon ap Gwynfor to reply to the debate. 

Thank you very much, Llywydd. 

So, energy prices have skyrocketed to unprecedented levels over the last year. The price cap increase in April saw the average gas and electricity bill increase to north of £2,000 a year, a rise of £700. In the last 18 months alone, the cost of heating a home has doubled. This will hit the poorest and most vulnerable households the hardest, with many having to go without, rationing or even, as Delyth mentioned, self-disconnecting. On top of this, energy bill arrears are currently greater in Wales than in any other UK nation. Yesterday, Jordan, a pupil from Ysgol Cefn Coch in Penrhyndeudraeth asked me, 'Why is it that fuel is so expensive, and what are you doing about it in the Senedd?' Children are talking about this, and it's causing huge anxieties. Can you, Minister, honestly answer Jordan and say that, as a Government, you are doing everything within your abilities? This is why we must ensure that those that are entitled to access the winter fuel support scheme are aware of it in the first place, with some estimates of take-up being as low as 50 per cent. Yes, the Minister said in her response that awareness was crucial, so the Welsh Government should launch a co-ordinated awareness campaign to improve on this figure, and also release take-up statistics to allow for improvement and proper scrutiny. 

We also know that things are going to get worse before they get better, with energy bills predicted to rise around £2,800 on average after the next price cap review in October, and may well rise again in January if Ofgem decide to review every three months, rather than every six months. And today the BBC are reporting energy experts saying that they expect energy bills to reach £3,000 a year. All this while energy companies are making record profits. 

The consequences of these rises would be devastating for so many. We have to ensure that all those who need help are entitled to it, by expanding the eligibility criteria for the winter fuel support scheme and adding a discretionary element for those in unexpected need. In my own constituency, we have some of the highest fuel poverty rates in the UK. Meanwhile, we're generating so much electricity, yet not reaping the rewards for it. Take Tanygrisiau, for example—a highly impoverished community with unacceptably high levels of people in fuel poverty. Yet, above Tanygrisiau lies Stwlan reservoir, owned and run by First Hydro-Engie UK, with a generating capacity of 360 MW, all of which goes to the grid while the community directly beneath it suffers from extreme fuel poverty. How can this be fair? 

The Minister made an announcement about a new fuel support scheme, and that's fantastic and really welcome to hear. But rural poverty is a huge issue that the winter fuel support scheme and current support schemes are failing to tackle. Firstly, not all local authorities are issuing the winter fuel support scheme to those off-grid residents, because of the wording of the Welsh Government's scheme. And secondly, for those that do issue the support to people off-grid, the limit is set at £200, which will buy you 200 litres at today's oil prices, but oil distributors won't deliver anything less than 500 litres. So, £200 is no good to people off-grid. The same problems obviously apply to the fuel voucher schemes and discretionary payments. Off-grid residents are being discriminated against because of this and it must be resolved. 

So, high energy prices are here to stay and wages are not rising accordingly, with the Tory Government in London doing all they can to halt wage growth for fear of inflation. We therefore need to be proactive and willing to be constantly improving on what support we do provide here. So, we welcome what the Minister has said and accept that the main levers are with the UK Government, but we need to maximise what we can do in this Senedd. Diolch. 

The proposal is to agree the motion without amendment. Does any Member object? [Objection.] There is objection, and I therefore defer voting on the motion until voting time. 

Voting deferred until voting time.