4. Will the First Minister provide an update on the deposit-return scheme? OQ58360

Llywydd, our aim has been to develop the scheme as a partnership with the UK and Northern Ireland Governments. The absence of an Executive in Northern Ireland and the turmoil in Westminster are both affecting the timetable for publication of the final scheme design. That now seems likely to be further delayed into the autumn.

Minister, I've reviewed your answer to the questions that Joel James asked you back in May, and I don't ask my question to debate whether glass bottles should be or not be included in the scheme; the reality is that the four nations of the UK are now likely to take a different approach. And that being the case, I'm keen to explore how the Welsh Government would limit any competitive disadvantage or put mitigation measures in place to support small brewing businesses in Wales in particular. I note, from your answer to Joel, you mentioned that the Government could talk to the industry about the level of the annual registration fee, but, under the current options at the moment, small brewers would be required to buy new equipment to print labels and employ additional staff to facilitate additional processes. And I'm told the cost of that equipment would effectively mean that those businesses would not be able to continue to operate. So, can I ask you for an assurance that support and mitigation would be put in place for Welsh businesses, so they are not competitively disadvantaged? And I'd be grateful if you could set out your assessment of if the deposit-return scheme in Conwy was successful.

I thank the Member for those questions, Llywydd. We are indeed proposing measures to limit the impact on smaller businesses, and that does include the annual registration fee. We will look at mandatory labelling requirements, we will look at how online take-back obligations might be designed to see whether that can mitigate some of the impacts on the firms, but the principle is straightforward. It's the one I remember outlining to Mr James: the polluter must pay. What we're talking about are new obligations on those people who produce waste of this sort to make sure that we are able to deal with it more effectively in the future.

The deposit-return scheme is something we have, as I said, worked with the UK Government and with Northern Ireland on. The intention to include glass bottles in it was there in our common scheme until right at the end, when the UK Government decided to withdraw from what had been proposed. Scotland will go ahead with glass bottle inclusion, so there will be different schemes in different parts of the United Kingdom, and we will look to work with the sector to help them with that.

The pilot in Conwy, Llywydd, took place a year ago—it was in July of last year. Feedback from those participating in the pilot was positive, and the system that was used there, a unique serialisation code added to a drink bottle, means that the system has the potential to use existing kerbside collection alongside retail return points. So, I was very glad that the pilot took place in the way that it did. We've learnt from it, and we've particularly learnt that there is a genuine appetite amongst the public to make sure that we can do better in this area, and not only do we manage to recycle more of the materials that we use, but that we also have a positive impact on the littering that otherwise disfigures beautiful places like Conwy when these things that could be properly recycled are just abandoned, creating that environmental damage.