1. Questions to the Minister for Social Justice – in the Senedd at 1:40 pm on 25 January 2023.
Questions now from party spokespeople. The Conservative spokesperson, Altaf Hussain.
Thank you very much, Presiding Officer. Minister, on Monday, allegations about rampant sexism and misogyny at the WRU resurfaced. We watched as harrowing tales unfolded of women who had contemplated suicide as a result of sexist bullying. All the while, senior management failed to take any action at all. In the programme, Charlotte Wathan, who was hired by the WRU to help transform women’s rugby, described hearing a man she worked with say he wanted to rape her in his hotel room in front of other members of staff in the office, including a senior manager. The WRU did eventually investigate but failed to speak to key witnesses, including the alleged perpetrator. Minister, while I accept that dealing with the issues raised in the BBC programme is a matter for the WRU, we have to make it clear that such behaviour has no place in today’s Wales. Will you, as the Minister for equality, be meeting with the WRU to underline the fact that sexism and misogyny are not to be tolerated in any workplace, especially in such a high-profile one like the WRU?
Diolch yn fawr, Altaf Hussain. Thank you so much for making that strong statement this afternoon. I also watched the programme, as many did, I'm sure, across this Chamber. The details in those testimonies were absolutely devastating. I was just thinking again of the impact on those and the courage of the women who came forward—such courage to take after experiencing the harassment, the bullying, the abuse. But, I have to say, what came over was serious, I would say, institutional misogyny and sexism, which obviously imbued the organisation.
This is something that, of course, the Deputy Minister for Arts and Sport is engaging with. We fed back yesterday that she'd already met with WRU on the immediate actions it must take. But, I want to say, as Minister for Social Justice, that it is clear from our perspective, from our violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence strategy, women and girls have the right to be safe in all aspects of their lives. We are now extending our strategy to tackle abuse in the workplace and to challenge damaging behaviour and attitudes head on so that all women and girls in Wales can live fear free.
Thank you for that response, Minister. If only the WRU could be more like the FAW, who are to be congratulated for bringing in equal pay for male and female footballers. Of course, it behoves all of us to tackle misogyny head on. Chwarae Teg recently launched a petition aimed at making public spaces safer for women after the UN Women national committee UK found that 71 per cent of women in the UK have experienced sexual harassment in public places. Minister, what actions are the Welsh Government taking to ensure all our public spaces are safe for women and girls?
Thank you, again, for those very strong statements in support of our violence against women, domestic abuse and sexual violence strategy, which, as I said, is now tackling the root cause of the violence, misogyny and sexism that women are facing. This is a societal problem that needs societal responses. It requires all of us, including all with any power, to be challenged in terms of their behaviours.
I do welcome, of course, the good news that we've got equal pay for our female footballers, which is fantastic. We congratulate the Football Association of Wales for showing the way forward. I think one of the saddest things in watching that programme as well was the fact that those women rugby players are wonderful women in sport, and they haven't been given the chance and the support that they need. But, again, in terms of every aspect of life, I think this is a really strong and, I'm sure, cross-party backing for our strategy. We must continually raise this in terms of the cultural change that we need in all our institutions, which has been reflected here in those comments today.
Thank you, Minister. It's not just in public spaces that women do not feel safe. Even in the House of Commons Chamber, women face vile misogyny. Labour MP Rosie Duffield, during a recent speech on the Scottish gender reform Bill, was subject to vile abuse from fellow Labour MP Lloyd Russell-Moyle, who later went on to abuse every woman who raised concerns about the Bill. His actions should have been condemned, yet the Labour Party leadership doubled down, briefing against Rosie Duffield to the press, with Keir Starmer's head of comms saying that she should spend more time in her constituency and less time with J.K. Rowling. This had led Rosie to conclude that Labour has a women problem. Minister, is your Westminster colleague right? Is your party stonewalling women and allowing rampant sexism to blossom? Thank you.
I'm very sad that we have got to finish what were very powerful and strong questions with that very unfortunate tone. I'm very proud of the stance that we're taking. The fact is that we've got an LGBTQ+ plan actually being presented in this Chamber. I hope that will receive the support of the whole Chamber in terms of LGBTQ+ rights and the strong actions that we're taking. I call on you, the Welsh Conservatives, to say that you will be backing what we in the Welsh Government, with our partners in the co-operation agreement, are taking forward. Of course, we need to treat each other as politicians with tolerance and respect. And that applies to all parties, I have to say—your party as well, Altaf. But let's just now look forward to a positive reception to what I think is going to be a really pioneering plan that will be a plan that will be recognised across the world in terms of its respect for LGBTQ+ people in Wales.
Plaid Cymru spokesperson, Sioned Williams.
Thank you, Llywydd. Minister, I'm sure you will have seen the concerning statistics on deep poverty in Wales published by the Bevan Foundation this morning. The evidence is there of households having grave difficulty in affording the necessities in life—food, shelter, heat—because of very low income or no income at all, or because debt takes up a large proportion of their income. Energy costs, of course, contribute greatly to these debts, and National Energy Action has offered a picture of the lack of progress towards achieving the Welsh Government's fuel poverty targets in its recent monitoring report. The target was 5 per cent of Welsh households at most living in fuel poverty by 2035; there are now 45 per cent living in fuel poverty in Wales.
In our scrutiny session on your draft budget, you told the Equality and Social Justice Committee last week, when explaining why you are not continuing to fund the Wales fuel support scheme, that you are investing in the discretionary assistance fund and this will help those who find themselves in fuel poverty—and that's to be welcomed. So, can you therefore provide us with more information how the impact of this fund has been measured and will be evaluated against measures of poverty, and fuel poverty particularly?
Diolch yn fawr. That's a really important question in terms of the ways in which we have been seeking as a Welsh Government to tackle the cost-of-living crisis and, indeed, particularly the impact on fuel poverty. As I said in my response to questions and scrutiny in terms of the draft budget, unfortunately, we did not get the funding from the UK Government that would enable us to move forward on many of the important schemes that we've been developing and, indeed, delivering—£1.6 billion this year in terms of tackling the cost-of-living crisis.
I think the important question you ask is about the impact of our winter fuel support scheme. I'm pleased to say that, as of today, there's 72 per cent take-up of the £200. We widened the eligibility in line with many of the requests across this Chamber, following up the successful first phase of that winter fuel support scheme, and, indeed, the committee's engagement in that—the Equality and Social Justice Committee's engagement—as well. And certainly we'll be able to report back on the further outcomes. It's very much dependant on local authorities. We've identified that when authorities can automate and passport the benefits like our winter fuel support scheme, then it reaches the people who need it most. But there is a chance over the next few weeks; please, across this Chamber, urge your constituents to take up that £200 from the winter fuel support scheme.
And also—and this is very crucial as well—there are those on prepayment meters. Again, on Monday, I met with energy suppliers, and it is quite clear—and it was clear in the press over the weekend—that people are not getting the voucher. We know that households have got that £400, but people on prepayment meters haven't all got that £400. I held them to account on Monday: 'Why haven't you got those vouchers out?' It is their responsibility. But I will be, obviously, reporting back and monitoring the impact of our winter fuel support scheme, our partnership with the Fuel Bank Foundation, and also recognising that the way forward that we're taking is to ensure that people take up all the benefits that they're entitled to.
Thank you, Minister. I was asking particularly about the discretionary assistance fund, but perhaps we could return to that at another time.
I do have a question on prepayment meters and this concern that people are being forced onto them against their will, even when it's not safe for them to be on such a meter, which is contrary to the duty of the supplier to check that. I'm pleased that so many of us have supported Jack Sargeant's proposal, which poses some questions on this very issue.
We know that Citizens Advice have seen more people coming to them saying that they can't afford to top up their meters in past 12 months than in the past 10 years. This is clearly an urgent issue that needs to be addressed. So, how does the Welsh Government encourage social landlords to enable their tenants to pay for their energy through alternative methods, if they want to do that? The Westminster Government over the weekend has encouraged suppliers not to force customers to prepay for their energy, but that's not a prohibition. Has the Welsh Government made any effort to seek the powers necessary to ban or limit the use of meters in Wales?
I thank you for that question, and I would also like to recognise and congratulate Jack Sargeant. Jack Sargeant has called over the past few weeks consistently for a ban on the forced installation of prepayment meters, and it is also a ban that I have endorsed and also raised with UK Ministers.
I have met with energy providers. As I just said, I met with them again on Monday, and the first thing I said is how appalled we are about, of course, the revelations about the ways in which court warrants are being used—I know there's a topical question about this—to force people to install prepayment meters without any permission from the customer. I said to them again that we cannot accept that this is the right practice. These are the most vulnerable people, in terms of prepayment meters. I've already mentioned that there's a low uptake of prepayment vouchers for traditional prepayment households—a 72 per cent redemption figure recently quoted by Ofgem. But, I also raised with them the importance that we should now move towards a social tariff, which, of course, would mean that we would address some of the issues relating to the most vulnerable customers.
Again, I've mentioned the fact that we've got our partnership with the Fuel Bank Foundation. Already, we've got about 70 partners signing up with them. I recall the question, Sioned Williams, about, perhaps, not all foodbanks knowing about it. We have spread that word. I've met again, actually, just this morning, with the End Child Poverty Network, the Trussell Trust, Children in Wales and Child Poverty Action Group—all of the organisations working with us on our tackling child poverty strategy—to make sure that people do take up our Fuel Bank Foundation prepayment vouchers. But, yes, we need to look, and I continuously look, to what we can do with our powers to actually work with and support the most vulnerable, the poorest.
I'll just finally say what I said on Monday to the energy providers: 'Stop making these standing charges'. This is absolutely critical. One told me that they didn't make the standing charges. They should all be in that position, and I'd be grateful if we could have support on that across the Chamber. Standing charges are being made even if people actually are not able to access energy as a result of a lack of money or vouchers to feed the meters.