Part of the debate – in the Senedd at 5:12 pm on 21 March 2023.
Just to finish with the independence point—and I think this is important—as Sir Wyn Williams did say, justice must be seen to be done. The Welsh Tribunals unit—as you mentioned, and as has been stressed in every annual report by Sir Wyn—is independent, but the fact is it is based in Cathays Park, in the headquarters of Welsh Government, which could be a party in a tribunal. If this was happening in Westminster, we would rightly protest. It shouldn't happen in Wales, and it's not a good reflection on how we do things here in Wales. So, if not a non-ministerial department, what other options are you considering, Gwnsler Cyffredinol? Diolch yn fawr.