Questions Without Notice from Party Spokespeople

2. Questions to the Minister for International Relations and Welsh Language – in the Senedd at 2:25 pm on 22 May 2019.

Alert me about debates like this

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:25, 22 May 2019

(Translated)

I now call the party spokespeople to question the Minister. Plaid Cymru spokespeson, Delyth Jewell.

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru

Diolch, Llywydd. Minister, there is a general consensus that Wales isn't doing enough to engage with its diaspora. There are likely tens of millions of people with Welsh ancestry living across the world, including over 10 million people in the US alone, according to a 2006 study. Better engaging our diaspora has the potential to increase Wales's profile, provide expertise, bring investment and boost exports. World leaders in engaging diaspora include New Zealand's Kea initiative and Scotland's Global Scot. Both exploit the expertise of diaspora communities to the benefit of local enterprises. Minister, will your soon-to-be-published 'Wales and the World' strategy include a specific action plan to better engage the Welsh diaspora, and do you agree with me that this should be Government led, although, of course working in conjunction with the excellent work currently undertaken by organisations such as GlobalWelsh?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour 2:26, 22 May 2019

Thank you. I think there's a recognition that we need to do more to engage our diaspora. I think that figure of 10 million is quite ambitious, and whether we'd be able to reach out to all 10 million people who have some kind of association with Wales is questionable. But I do think that the best people to tell our story are people who have a passion for our nation. We've looked already at the models of New Zealand and Scotland, and we've been looking at what they do in terms of best practice. So, we are looking at how and what the best model is in relation to our activities. But also, whilst recognising that, actually, there are other actors in this field already, we need to make sure that we're not stepping on each other's toes, so we respect each other's areas. But there are clear areas where the Welsh Government will need to be taking a lead and, of course, this will be referred to in the international strategy.

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru

Thank you for your answer, Minister. Engaging the Welsh diaspora is also crucial in order to boost Wales's profile on the international stage, as you've alluded to. There is a meme currently doing the rounds online where a couple of Americans—I'm not going to try and do their accent, but they ask their friend whether he comes from England or Wales, and when he replies, 'Neither; I'm Welsh', they look confused and they ask him, 'So, is that in England or in Ireland?' Now, it's a joke, but it does reflect a sad truth, which is that Wales isn't as widely recognised as other nations of the British Isles. It's surely time that Wales became one of the most recognised substate nations in the world.

Your global strategy, therefore, has to include a plan to increase Welsh Government presence abroad from the current 15 offices in seven countries to many more. Will you commit to this? Smart solutions could be considered as part of this work, such as looking into co-locating with Foreign and Commonwealth Offices, and more needs to be done as well to bring high-profile major events to Wales. Hosting the Champions League Final in Cardiff was an unqualified success. So, will you give serious consideration to bringing the Commonwealth Games to Wales as soon as practicable, as well as looking at what other major cultural, industrial and diplomatic events could be attracted here?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour 2:28, 22 May 2019

Thank you. I think you're absolutely right that we need to raise the profile of Wales internationally. What is clear is that we are recognised in different markets very differently—so, areas where there is a big rugby tradition, we're pretty well known, but there are other areas and parts of the world where we have very little in terms of common historic background, and those are the areas that are much more difficult to access, which is why, I think, we do need to go back to diaspora. But also I think we do need to recognise we will not be able to do everything with a limited budget. So, part of what we do need to do in the international strategy is to recognise that we will need to focus and we can't do it all. Of course, we do have those 20 offices around the world at the moment. We need them to make sure that they are delivering in raising that profile, in landing inward investment, and, of course, they are currently, the vast majority of them, co-located with the FCO.

In terms of major events, yes, this is an opportunity always for us to get global attention onto our small nation. That has worked spectacularly well in terms of football in the past. Of course, if we want to attract these events, then there is a budget that goes with that. The Commonwealth Games is a pretty significant budget, so we do need to look at the restrictions we have in this age of austerity, but, of course, we shouldn't lack ambition. In the meantime, I think we've got to make sure that we take every opportunity—for example, in things like the Rugby World Cup in Japan—to really use that as a platform for us to bounce off and to really make sure that we are recognised globally, not just for sport, but also using that as an opportunity to increase inward investment. 

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru 2:30, 22 May 2019

I'd like to turn now to trade links, which are, of course, crucial in order to secure Wales's economic health, especially in terms of exports. I noted with interest your recent trip to the United States, where you made the case for inward investment by selling Wales as an attractive place to do business. That was a welcome move. But I wonder whether your strategy of building trade links is not completely undermined by your Government's Brexit policy. We currently have the best possible trading relationship with the EU, including trade deals with third-party countries. Isn't remaining in the EU, or at least in the single market, absolutely crucial in order to avoid undoing everything you're trying to achieve with trade? And if so, how do you justify your Government's policy of wanting to leave both?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour

Thank you. Well, clearly, we have an ambition to increase inward investment, and that is difficult when investors don't know what that relationship with our largest market—500 million people—will be in the future. So, I think there is a break in terms of investment, although, if you look at the absolute figures, we are actually performing very well at the moment. But if you look at why people traditionally have come here, then, yes, they have come here as a launch pad, very often, to get access to that market of 500 million people. That's why we are slightly shifting our emphasis at the moment to really focus on exports, because that is significant; we've seen significant growth in that area in the past couple of years. So, we want to do more in that space. But also, what we'll be doing is to concentrate on those areas relating to inward investment that will not be impacted in quite such a significant way by Brexit. So, we need to take that into consideration when we look for where we are looking to focus in the new international strategy. 

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:32, 22 May 2019

(Translated)

Conservative spokesperson, Darren Millar.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative

Diolch yn fawr, Llywydd. Minister, can I ask you about the relationship between Wales and Japan? You've already hinted at the fact that we've got the Rugby World Cup coming up later this year. What action has the Welsh Government taken already to prepare for engagement during the Rugby World Cup in Japan?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour

We've already done some significant organisation. In fact, I am, later on this afternoon, meeting our official who is based out in Japan, who has come back to discuss this very issue. I think it's important that we recognise the long-established relationship that has been between Wales and Japanese companies that have been coming here and investing here for the past 30 years. We want that relationship to continue. I'm afraid we've seen Sony and Panasonic move their European headquarters from the United Kingdom already. So, those people who say it's not going to have an impact, I think you just need to look at that. But that's not to say that, actually, those relationships we have in Wales, where there is a real affinity and a love for Wales in Japan—the hiraeth society is quite famous. And one of the things we'll be doing, of course, is to see what we can do—. We're not waiting until the world cup; we are already bouncing into those markets now. I know that Lesley Griffiths is doing a huge amount of work in terms of promoting food and drink into Japan. So, those opportunities are there, and what we'll be doing now is to really work out exactly what we are trying to achieve during that period of the world cup, because this is a launch pad not just for Japan, but I think for the broader Asian community as well. 

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 2:33, 22 May 2019

You've already made mention of the fact that we have those opportunities later this year. We've got, of course, the UK-Japan Season of Culture, which is also coming up, including events that are going to be held here in Wales. One of the other things that we've got in common, of course, with Japan is that we're both nations with monarchs, and I'm sure you'd want to congratulate Emperor Naruhito and the Empress Masako on the Emperor's recent enthronement on the Chrysanthemum Throne, something that we on the Conservative benches welcome very much indeed. Will you take every opportunity to do what you can to work on the good relations that we've already got with the nation of Japan, given those historic links, given the major events that have taken place in Japan, and the sporting and other events that are coming up in the calendar this year? We know that in excess of 6,500 jobs in Wales are dependent on the Japanese investment that has come in, and we know that Japanese companies are still investing in the UK, in spite of some of the uncertainties around Brexit. We recently saw significant investment by Toyota and, indeed, Nissan in the UK. But Wales doesn't seem to getting dollops of that cash. So, can you tell us specifically, in terms of trade strategy with Japan, how are you going to make sure that Wales punches above its weight as it did under the Conservative Governments in the 1990s?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour 2:35, 22 May 2019

Thank you. Well, I think it was rather grand—the Emperor's installation—but I think what is important, though, is that we look to how we can build on those relationships, as you suggested. We have the Japanese ambassador coming to Wales for a two-day period in June. I'll be hosting a reception with him and entertaining also many of those Japanese companies that have made their homes here in Wales. I think we have to be realistic in terms of the trade relationships. You’ve got to remember that the EU has just signed a trade deal with Japan and we will have access to that trade deal for as long as we are a member of the European Union. But the moment we leave, then we will have to start developing our own trade relationship, and clearly when you’re negotiating a trade deal on behalf of 60 million people, it’s very different compared to negotiating a trade deal with 500 million other people. So, we do have to, I think, be realistic, but I think the fact that we have this long-established tradition and that we have those close relationships that have been built up over many years—. I know that there’s a real love for Conwy castle in north Wales amongst the Japanese, for example. So, there are great opportunities for us to, I think, exploit that relationship further, but more than anything to develop on the friendship between our two nations.

Photo of Darren Millar Darren Millar Conservative 2:36, 22 May 2019

I'm very pleased to hear about the ambassadorial welcome that you're going to give later in June, because I think that these relationships are incredibly important to raising the profile of Wales, not just in Japan but in wider Asia and the world as you've already mentioned. You'll be aware that cherry trees are being planted across Wales at the moment, as part of the Japan-UK initiative. In fact, we're getting more cherry trees, as I understand it, than any other nation within the UK, in terms of our size.

One of the things that the Welsh Government has done historically to promote relationships between Wales and different nations around the world is to explore the whole idea of memoranda of understanding. I understand that the first one of these was signed with the Republic of Latvia a number of years back, but it does appear that those memoranda are not really being regarded much. I wonder whether this is a tool that you could use and usefully bring to the attention of the Japanese Government in terms of a way forward of promoting links between Wales and Japan and looking at those specific areas where we've got good relationships and working on those where we could have even better relationships going forward in the future. So, I would point you to the memorandum of understanding between Latvia and the Welsh Government as something that could be repeated with many other nations, including Japan, in the future. And will you also extend an invitation to the new Emperor to visit Wales at the earliest opportunity?

Photo of Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Baroness Mair Eluned Morgan Labour 2:38, 22 May 2019

My goodness, we'll have to roll out the red carpet for that, won't we? But thank you very much. I think, in terms of memoranda of understanding, different nations like to use these in different ways. Some nations are very keen on these; others are not so keen and they would rather action plans. So, I think we've got to look for horses for courses, and see what works best for both our nations, rather than just run around and sign MoUs. If we are going to sign MoUs, I'm very keen to make sure that they are a delivery body rather than simply a friendship relationship. So, one of the key things that I'm really keen on doing is to focus and to get more out of things. So, I don't really want to go trotting around the world signing memoranda of understanding with every nation in the world. That will not be the approach that we'll be taking in the international strategy.