5. What new steps is the Welsh Government taking to address COVID-19 transmission levels? OQ57467

We are supporting all areas in reducing community transmission. Local action and protections are targeted at areas where rates are increasing. The virus spreads more easily in urban areas where the population density is higher.

Thank you, Minister. I welcome the steps that you have outlined in your respone. The pandemic has clearly revealed the socioeconomic inequalities that exist within our society, and indeed have exacerbated those inequalities. These inequalities are also health inequlaities, with a clear relationship between one's socioeconomic situation and the impact of COVID on them. Figures from England show that those living in communities described as being left behind are 46 per cent more likely to die of COVID as compared to those not living in these communities, and the 'Locked Out' report in Wales noted that socioeconomic factors play a crucial role in the higher level of deaths among disabled people and the impact on their health and care compared to the rest of the population as a result of COVID. It's clear therefore that the Government's health policy for the future needs to do more to deal with these inequalities as we continue to tackle COVID levels and its impact, including long COVID. Could the Government therefore ensure that any new steps to tackle the transmission and impact of COVID incorporate clear strategies to tackle these health inequalities? Thank you.

Thank you very much, Sioned. This follows on from the discussion we had in the Senedd last week. I thought that was a very detailed and appropriate debate from everyone who contributed. We're highly aware of the difference in terms of where COVID has hit hardest, and it's clear that those in poorer areas, in poorer households have suffered more than other areas. Therefore, as we rebuild from the pandemic, clearly we consider these issues not just in terms of health but across Government in order that we do more to ensure that we don't see those inequalities for the future.

From a health perspective, I have made it very clear to the health boards that we would see the same outcome if we were to have another pandemic, unless we do things differently. So, from my perspective, I've been entirely clear with the health boards that we do have to tackle the issue of prevention. We have to stop people from smoking. We've been discussing obesity too. All of those factors are crucially important in terms of individual health for the future. But it's not something that is limited to health; it is crucial that we consider education, the economy, and all of the other issues that contribute to the way in which people live.

Minister, despite having the most stringent measures in place to curb the transmission of COVID-19, Wales has the highest infection rates of any home nation and one of the highest per capita death rates in the world. Does your Government now accept that the non-pharmaceutical interventions are now doing more harm than good? And with, according to your chief medical officer, over 90 per cent of the Welsh population possessing COVID-19 antibodies, do you accept that we now have to learn to live with COVID, rather than focusing our efforts on how to stop it?

Thanks very much, Gareth. I almost encouraged you, didn't I, yesterday, to ask me this question, so I'm very pleased that you have asked me this question, because it gives me an opportunity to say that, actually, the data we've had so far actually suggests that those restrictions were helpful. We've certainly seen a difference in terms of hospitalisation. We're just waiting for that data to be processed. England certainly had higher rates in terms of hospitalisation compared to all of the other three nations that introduced restrictions. It's still early days, so we'll wait for that final data to be published, hopefully by the end of this week.

I think, also, this is about counting, Gareth. So, the way we count cases is different in all four nations. For example, England doesn't count reinfections, so that could make a considerable difference. Wales does count reinfections if they are 42 days apart. That makes a big difference to the numbers. Our policy on testing changed, of course, so that may have made a difference. Also, I think what you'll find is that people modified their behaviour in England when they heard the chief medical officer, because, obviously, your Prime Minister was not in a position to tell anyone to do anything because of all the parties he'd been holding. So, what happened is that people listened to the chief medical officer in England and they curbed their behaviour. What they didn't have in England was the kind of economic support that we were able to give to our businesses because of the protections that we put in place. I'm pleased to say that the indications so far are that it was helpful to put those restrictions in place, but, obviously, we will need to wait for a few more days just to be absolutely confident that that is the case.

Certainly, the statistics I've seen so far are that we had about 170,000 people with COVID. If we were in the same position as England, we'd have had 40,000 extra people with COVID, and if we were in London, we'd have seen almost 70,000 people additional having COVID. That would be the whole of the millennium stadium being filled additionally on top of the numbers that we had. So, those are some of the early calculations, but, obviously, we wait for that data to be comprehensive.