2. Statement by the First Minister: Coronavirus (COVID-19)

– in the Senedd at 1:33 pm on 20 May 2020.

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Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 1:33, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

I thank the First Minister. The next item is a statement by the First Minister on coronavirus.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour

(Translated)

Thank you, Llywydd. In responding to the coronavirus crisis, the Welsh Government has had to act more swiftly and more expansively than ever before. As this is the last Senedd Plenary before Whitsun I will provide a summary of our actions across all Government departments.

We have acted to slow the spread of the virus in order to support public services and to assist individuals and businesses facing very difficult times. In the time available, I’m only able to provide a summary, but in looking back, it’s striking just how much has happened in a period of just two months. We must continue to work equally as hard over the coming weeks as we prepare for the next steps.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:34, 20 May 2020

Llywydd, I will begin with the impact of the virus on our finances. In just over a few months since the Welsh Government’s budget for 2020-21 was passed in the Senedd, the budget has increased by more than 10 per cent. We have moved rapidly to allocate those funds, together with repurposing existing budgets and realigning European funding. We have provided £40 million—I beg your pardon—. We have realigned European funding to meet the urgent purposes we face.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:35, 20 May 2020

In the supplementary budget, to be published next week, we will allocate more than £2.4 billion in support of our COVID-19 efforts. And that will include: nearly £0.5 billion extra to the health and social care budget to ensure that it has the funding it needs to protect the health of the people of Wales; an additional £1.3 billion to the budget for economy and transport, providing a wholly unprecedented level of support for the economy and a package of measures more substantial than anywhere else in the United Kingdom. This includes the £500 million economic resilience fund, which itself includes £400 million in revenue and £100 million in repurposed capital funding. Less than eight weeks from the launch, the fund has already provided loans from the development bank worth more than £87 million to more than 1,300 businesses and grants worth more than £100 million to more than 6,000 businesses.

The budget has also seen £0.5 billion extra provided to the housing and local government budget, with local authorities delivering key elements of the COVID-19 response, such as continued free school meal provision, increased support for care homes and for recruiting and managing volunteers. Llywydd, this funding also includes our support for businesses in the hospitality, retail and leisure sectors, in the form of business rate relief, and the £10,000 and £25,000 grants that follow. Thanks to the enormous efforts of our local authorities, nearly 51,000 grants have already been paid out, at a cost of £621 million, and this support is a vital lifeline for all eligible businesses across Wales. Wherever possible, we have focused this support on businesses headquartered in Wales, and we have made it clear that businesses based in tax havens will not be eligible for COVID-19 financial support from the Welsh Government.

Llywydd, the impact of our investments has been felt across Wales, and especially amongst the most vulnerable. We have provided £40 million for free school meals, reaching an estimated 60,000 children in Wales. We have provided £24 million to support the third sector and volunteering. Over 17,500 new volunteers have been recruited in Wales during this crisis, more than double the previous number, and because we have an existing national system for volunteers, we have been able to make rapid use of that huge willingness to help. And, so far, 7,000 volunteers have been deployed to help directly in the coronavirus effort.

One of the purposes for which these volunteers have been deployed has been in helping to get food and medicines to people in the shielded group. There are now 130,000 people on the shielding list, with nearly 13,000 added by GPs since the system began. Fifteen million pounds has been provided to make food boxes available to people in the shielded category and thousands of boxes have been delivered to those individuals, and 77,000 priority home delivery slots have been made available for that group to be booked with supermarkets.

Llywydd, thousands of people work in our social care system in Wales; they have been at the forefront of the national effort to save lives. We have set aside £32 million to provide a £500 payment to the 64,000 people delivering personal care in residential and domiciliary care services.

For the very poorest in our society, the discretionary assistance fund has provided help of last resort here in Wales, ever since the social fund was abandoned by the UK Government. During the coronavirus crisis, the fund has become an ever more important lifeline for many families. To date, 13,679 payments have been made at a cost of more than £850,000, and so that we can continue to offer this vital assistance, the fund has been increased by £11 million in recent weeks.

Llywydd, the past eight weeks have seen a transformation in the capacity of our health service: an additional 368 beds have been created through field hospitals, with a further 4,666 available if required; as of 18 May, 220 extra critical care beds were available through the huge efforts of our staff; testing capacity has increased to over 5,300 a day, and 11,000 tests are being carried out every week—capacity will increase further in the weeks ahead; and 98.4 million items of PPE have been issued since 9 March, of which, just under 30 million have gone to staff in care homes and in domiciliary care. 

That scale of provision has only been possible because of our relationships abroad and our ability to make things at home. To mention just one example, manufacturing company Hardshell is creating a new factory in Cardiff to produce up to a million fluid resistant face masks every day for front-line workers in Wales and the rest of the United Kingdom. And it is because of this enormous effort, right across Wales by our public services and our people, that we have protected our NHS and saved lives.

The death toll, with all its human heartbreak, continues to rise, but the number of deaths reported in yesterday’s weekly Office for National Statistics publication showed that figure falling in each of the previous three weeks. And, as we move into the world in which lockdown is cautiously and gradually lifted here in Wales, so we will need to adapt our approach. This week, the Minister for Health and Social Services announced changes to testing in care homes and in the wider community. We are moving to a wider system of surveillance of the circulation of the virus, beyond key workers and key settings, through the 'Test Trace Protect' strategy published last week.

Llywydd, I have illustrated the breadth and depth of the Welsh Government’s activity in response to the pandemic. Our approach has been distinctive in building on our social partnership model, and in assisting those in greatest need. We will continue to work with the UK Government on measures that require a common approach, and will shortly make regulations dealing with border controls. Although borders are not a devolved matter, public health regulations covering the operation of these measures in Wales are a matter for Welsh Ministers. We are currently considering the right arrangements for implementation here, within the UK-wide system.

And, Llywydd, I will end by mentioning the impact of the virus on children and young people in Wales. Last week, we launched a new survey asking people between the ages of seven and 18 for their views during the coronavirus pandemic. 'Coronavirus and Me' asks about their health, education, the impact on social aspects of their lives, and the needs of specific groups. Understanding the experience of young people will be vital to our work on moving out of lockdown, and on planning for the future of our economy and society in a post-COVID Wales. All our futures have been at stake in this crisis, but for our children and young people, that has been most acute. We will continue to report to the Senedd on all the actions we are taking to support them and wider society here in Wales. Diolch yn fawr.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 1:44, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

Plaid Cymru leader, Adam Price.

Photo of Adam Price Adam Price Plaid Cymru

First Minister, on 20 March, the Royal College of Surgeons recommended that anosmia, the loss of a sense of smell, should be added to the list of COVID-19 symptoms, and that was discussed by the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies on 24 March. A paper for SAGE on 16 April confirmed that the loss of smell and taste was a strong predictor of infection. Why did it take until Monday of this week for you to change the guidance to the public? And do you accept that people who should have been self-isolating haven't been doing so because of this delay?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour

Llywydd, I don't necessarily accept that last point. Mr Price outlined a process that went on from March onwards. We changed the policy in Wales, along with all other nations of the United Kingdom, following a statement from the four UK chief medical officers. That was the culmination of the process that began with the Royal College of Surgeons's statement at the end of March. It was right that the four chief medical officers came together, made that determination, and all four Governments moved together once that decision had been made.

Photo of Adam Price Adam Price Plaid Cymru 1:45, 20 May 2020

I think it's important to place on the record that clinicians have criticised that length of delay—two months since the Royal College of Surgeons made the case in the first instance.

Speed of decision making will no doubt be one of the key questions that a retrospective inquiry will want to look at, as the health Minister has already alluded to this week. You previously said you don't want to get into this now, though I note that Una O'Brien, the former permanent secretary of the department of health in England, has said that you need to begin now setting up an inquiry because it can take as much as six months. Could you make some general commitments today to the principle of setting up an independent public inquiry in due course, to ensuring in the meantime that all relevant documentation, minutes, e-mails, even Zoom recordings, First Minister, are being safely kept, and, lastly, that the inquiry will at least begin to receive evidence before the end of the year so that interim findings can be published, at the latest, by the spring of next year?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:46, 20 May 2020

Well, Llywydd, I've no doubt that an independent inquiry will be required at the right point in that process and the documents that are kept by the Welsh Government are kept meticulously and I'm sure that they will be available for that inquiry when the time for it comes. I'm not able to anticipate when that will be, but the principle that Mr Price has outlined—I'm very happy to confirm my support for that principle.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 1:47, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

Leader of the opposition, Paul Davies. 

Photo of Paul Davies Paul Davies Conservative

Diolch, Llywydd. First Minister, last week, you published the Welsh Government's road map to lifting Wales out of the lockdown. As well as outlining your Government's plans, you had an opportunity to offer the people of Wales hope—hope that the current crisis will end. Unfortunately, your road map offered no timescales and no milestones in order to track its progress, including much-needed milestones around testing capacity and the virus transmission rate. The road map also offers no financial allocations to support delivery of the Welsh Government strategy and offers very little to businesses and individuals to get through the pandemic, and, crucially, it offered no real leadership to the people of Wales. First Minister, is this road map the best hope that the Welsh Government can actually offer the people of Wales and when can we expect to see some timescales alongside your exit strategy?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:48, 20 May 2020

Well, Llywydd, there's a whole debate on the road map later this afternoon, when, no doubt, these points can be rehearsed again. I completely reject the Member's suggestion that there is no leadership on this matter; the road map was very widely welcomed in Wales, and beyond Wales, indeed, as a clear statement of the direction of travel that the Welsh Government has set out for people in our country.

On timescales, let me say, as I've said before when I've been asked, there's a genuine debate to be had as to whether timescales are a helpful way of setting out the future. In the end, we thought that it was more of a distraction than a concentration on the matters that really deserve our attention. We're doing the same as many other countries across the globe, from New Zealand to Northern Ireland. Timescales are no guarantee, are they, as Mr Davies will well know. Look how the 1 June timetable for opening schools in England is falling apart in the hands of the Government of England; how Downing Street last night had to say that 1 June was an aspiration, not a deadline, not a timescale after all. So, I'm not sure that timescales are an answer to everything.

Financial allocations will be set out in detail in the supplementary budget, which will be available to Members next week, and I have already set out, Llywydd, this afternoon, the most generous set of support for businesses anywhere in the United Kingdom, and that detail is available to businesses in Wales and has been very widely welcomed by them.

Photo of Paul Davies Paul Davies Conservative 1:50, 20 May 2020

Well, I put it to you, First Minister, that it is important in any plan that people are given hope when the restrictions start being lifted, and giving an indication of timescales I don't believe is unreasonable.

Now let me turn instead to areas where you have, thankfully, changed your policy. I welcome the news, of course, that the Welsh Government has finally reversed its decision and will be taking part in a UK-wide portal scheme. This means key workers in Wales will be on a level playing field with their counterparts in other parts of the UK in the fight against COVID-19. It's also good to hear that the Welsh Government has changed its policy on testing in care homes, and now testing will be extended to all care home residents and staff in Wales. And I'm pleased that you've listened to my party's calls, and I hope that you'll publish the specific clinical and scientific evidence that has led to this change in policy, so the people of Wales can have confidence in the Welsh Government's decisions.

Now, moving forward, the Welsh Government has made it clear that its 'Test Trace Protect' programme must become operational by the end of the month in order for lockdown restrictions to start being lifted. First Minister, given that the Government would need to increase its testing capacity for those in hospital, care homes and key workers to about 20,000 by the end of the month—and, let's be clear, you've not met a testing target you've set so far—how confident are you that you'll actually reach this one?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:51, 20 May 2020

Llywydd, let me begin by explaining again why we are now able to be part of the UK-wide portal—and we're very glad to be part of that UK-wide portal. We're able to do it because a problem with the portal has now been put right. Because the portal as it was originally constructed meant that tests carried out on Welsh residents could not be reported into the Welsh NHS or to those patients' records. And, in that sense, the tests that were being carried out were of limited value, because we didn't know the results of them. That has been put right; we're now confident that tests carried out through that UK-wide portal will be reported back into the patients' records and into the Welsh NHS, and I'm very glad that we've been able to be part of that.

Our testing in care homes policy follows the advice we are provided with by SAGE. On Thursday of last week, SAGE changed its advice. On Friday, the UK Government changed its policy. On Saturday, we announced that we would be changing our policy in line with that advice, and, on Monday, the Northern Ireland Executive announced that it was changing its policy, again in line with the advice. When the advice changes, the policy changes here in Wales, and I know Paul Davies will be glad that, on 15 May, our own technical advisory group published a paper, 'Testing for COVID-19 in care homes', which the health Minister has made available to all Members, setting out the evidence that underpinned that change in advice.

We continue to make all the arrangements for the TTP arrangements to be put in place. We are working with others, including with the UK Government. Vaughan Gething took part last night in a meeting with Matt Hancock and with the health Ministers of Northern Ireland and of Scotland to share information on how, across the United Kingdom, those new surveillance arrangements can be put in place, and we continue to work on all the different elements that that new approach will need and to do it in close collaboration with others.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 1:53, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

Leader of the Brexit Party, Mark Reckless.

Photo of Mark Reckless Mark Reckless Conservative 1:54, 20 May 2020

First Minister, last week I asked you about your Government revising the coronavirus regulations to remove the requirement that restrictions be necessary. You responded as if I'd suggested the restrictions needn't be proportionate. The record shows that I criticised you for removing the requirement that restrictions be necessary. I concluded by stating that the Westminster requirement for any restrictions to be reasonable and proportionate still held, and that you should be held to account against that. Of course, you and I will have different views about whether restrictions are reasonable and proportionate, and, ultimately, only a judicial review would be determinative. However, why should people in Wales be subject to the most extraordinary, intrusive and prescriptive restrictions on their freedom if they are not necessary? Many who had not before understood the scope of devolved powers don't now like the answer: it's because of devolution, because they live in Wales, and because the Welsh Government, and, presumably, later today the Senedd, make those laws. The Prime Minister of the United Kingdom may consider your restrictions unnecessary. He may completely disagree with your continuity Corbyn equality tests for lifting them. But, as many people are now learning, his writ as British Prime Minister on this, as so many matters, extends to England only. In Wales, the UK Government has been stripped of those powers.

The BBC has run into some trouble in Scotland for suggesting the First Minister there enjoyed exercising the powers, and the correspondent has rightly apologised. However much I disagree with your decisions as First Minister to continue imposing restrictions in Wales that have been lifted in England, I accept you do so from motives of sincere public service. However, do you think one consequence of the crisis for us in Wales will be people understanding devolution better, and how far powers have been shifted from the UK Government and Parliament to your Government and the Senedd? Do you agree that a significant number of people in Wales are only now recognising the extent of this, and how do you respond to the many who would prefer the British Prime Minister to take key decisions rather than you? 

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 1:56, 20 May 2020

Well, Llywydd, let me begin by agreeing with something that Mr Reckless said, that the powers that we exercising are extraordinary, that they represent a level of intrusion into people's lives that is unprecedented, and everything we do has to be tested and tested again to make sure that it is something required to protect the health of people here in Wales. That's where the bar is for me, and we think very carefully indeed about any of the restrictions that we put in place, and we've had this debate on the floor of the Senedd in relation, for example, to second homes—whether more draconian steps should be taken to prevent people from occupying property that they own, and that a couple of months ago we wouldn't have dreamt of thinking about whether they should be prevented from doing so, and I've so far come to the conclusion that it isn't proportionate to do that. So, I just want to give him that assurance that we police this line absolutely consciously. We may come to different views on where the line should be drawn, but we are not doing it in any arbitrary or unthinking way.

I agree with what Mr Reckless has said about devolution being brought home to people in this crisis in a way that it hasn't been over the last 20 years. I doubt that it is true that in Wales people aren't aware of devolution. It is certainly true that people outside Wales and in London appear to have woken up from a 20-year sleep on the devolution agenda. I think people's views in Wales are really clear. People in Wales support the careful, cautious way in which we are exercising the lift out of lockdown. They would rather be here with a Government that puts their health, their well-being, at the very front of what we are doing, and they do not look enviously on the way in which these things are being conducted across our border.

Photo of Mick Antoniw Mick Antoniw Labour 1:58, 20 May 2020

First Minister, Boris Johnson, in Prime Minister's questions today, says that he believes it is right to charge low-paid, front-line healthcare workers, coming from abroad to work in the NHS, the immigration health surcharge, amounting to hundreds of pounds or more a year. Now, Keir Starmer, the Labour leader and the leader of the opposition in Parliament, quoted a letter from doctors and medical organisations, which said:

'At a time when we are mourning colleagues your steadfast refusal to reconsider the deeply unfair immigration health surcharge is a gross insult to all...this country at its time of greatest need.'

Now, he indicated that there will be a proposed amendment from the opposition to abolish that. I wonder if you agree, First Minister, that this surcharge is an insult to many front-line healthcare workers. 

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour

Well, Llywydd, I didn't have the opportunity myself to hear Prime Minister's questions today, though Mick Antoniw has very powerfully given an account of the debate there. Could I put his points in the wider context? This week, we have been seeing again immigration proposals from the UK Government that seek to distinguish between high-skilled and low-skilled people coming into our country, and to have arbitrary salary caps that prevent some people from being recruited to do vital work. Just to say again that, just as in the instance that Mick Antoniw has reported, so in that general case as well, the Welsh Government rejects that view of the world. If you have a skill that is necessary to be a care worker, you are the person still to do that job. To regard you as low skilled and therefore not worthy of being recruited into our public services, I think, is an anathema. The issue that Mick Antoniw has referred to, and was, as he said, debated earlier today elsewhere, is part of a wider pattern in which the UK Government declines to recognise the value of those people who carry out these vitally important front-line services, and that is, clearly, not a view that is at all shared here in Wales.

Photo of Delyth Jewell Delyth Jewell Plaid Cymru 2:01, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

First Minister, this crisis has proved the value of devolution, but has also highlighted a number of structural problems in the political landscape in Wales, and one of those is the weakness of the press. Last week, papers sold in Wales had a front-page advertisement, paid for by the UK Government, with the message, 'Stay alert', which wasn't applicable to Wales. The London newspapers are full of stories that are not relevant to Wales and this isn’t being explained and is causing confusion.

The same situation does not exist in Scotland, where there are Scottish versions of English newspapers and many Scottish-based newspapers. A YouGov survey recently reflected this, finding that 40 per cent of the people of Wales didn’t know enough about you to give a view on your performance. The corresponding figure for Sturgeon in Scotland was 6 per cent.

First Minister, what plans does the Welsh Government have to transform this situation, now that it’s a matter of safeguarding public health? Can you tell me whether the past few weeks have convinced you that we need to devolve broadcasting?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 2:02, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

Well, Llywydd, I agree that the current situation has strengthened devolution and has strengthened devolution in the thinking of the people of Wales. We had worked hard with the UK Government and, just to be fair, they have withdrawn a number of advertisements that they wanted to publish in Wales with 'Stay alert' and so on, but, at the end of the day, they couldn’t withdraw those things that were included in newspapers printed in London that are sold here in Wales.

I agree with what Delyth Jewell has said, that it is essential that we try to strengthen the messages that the people of Wales receive from people working in Wales in the press and also in the media. But, it is difficult for the Government to step into that gap, because Government funding would raise concerns with people as to whether that would have an impact on the situation and would put pressure on journalists to convey the news in the way that the Government would want to see it conveyed.

So, we have been working—we have been working with the committee chaired by Bethan Sayed—to think about what we can do to strengthen the position here in Wales. But, if the Government were to do too much, then that would create problems. It would assist us with some problems, but would raise other issues.

Photo of Russell George Russell George Conservative 2:04, 20 May 2020

First Minister, in your statement today you mentioned the ONS figures. When people hear what seems to be conflicting data in terms of cases, or cases of deaths, it does cause some anxiety. People in Powys, for example, would have heard news reports yesterday saying, unfortunately, there were 12 deaths in Powys, whereas the ONS figures report 75 deaths. Of course, this is because of the difference between Public Health Wales and the ONS in how they report data, and the fact that Powys does not have a district general hospital and, of course, because of the cross-border nature. What can you say to people who have this anxiety, which I think can cause some concern amongst people and distrust, I suppose, as well? What can be done to make data easier to understand for the public?

And also, secondly and related, when will the data reporting of care testing and, sadly, deaths in English hospitals for Welsh patients appear in the Public Health Wales figures?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 2:05, 20 May 2020

I thank Russell George for that. I think he gave a very good explanation himself of why there is a difference between the Public Health Wales figures and the ONS figures. I do understand, if you're not close to these things, it is difficult for people to understand the differences.

He will remember that, early in the coronavirus crisis, there was a considerable call from Members of the Senedd and beyond—and understandably too—for the most up-to-date information to be published as quickly as possible, and that's why Public Health Wales publishes the daily figures that they publish, and they are, as Russell George has said, deaths of people in hospital, and that's capable of being brought together on a daily basis. But, it doesn't represent the totality of the picture because it doesn't include people who have died outside hospital and in the community. That is more difficult to collect together quickly because it relies on death certification. There is a lag in that. The ONS figures, which are more comprehensive but a couple of weeks out of date, reflect the totality of the picture.

So, I suppose the only advice I can give to people who want to make sure they have the most comprehensive understanding of this is that they've got to look at both sets of data. They cover slightly different things. I think the comfort that people might be able to draw is that, while the specifics in terms of numbers differ, the trends are broadly the same. So, you're not looking at a completely different understanding of the picture; you're seeing the picture at a different point in time and on a different basis, but what they're telling us about the trends of coronavirus are broadly consistent.

I'll make an enquiry on his second point because I don't have that information directly with me and I'll make sure that we write to him and let him know the answer.

Photo of Alun Davies Alun Davies Labour 2:07, 20 May 2020

I'm grateful, Presiding Officer, for the statement the First Minister has made this afternoon. I have to say, I think overwhelmingly the people of Blaenau Gwent fully support the approach that he has taken and the Welsh Government have taken over the last two months. They overwhelmingly agree that his calm and cautious approach, and putting people's lives first, is the approach that is best suited for our needs. I hope he can reassure us all that he'll continue to resist those siren voices, and sometimes very strident voices, who tell us that we should be simply repeating slavishly all the catastrophic errors, misjudgments and mistakes that the United Kingdom Government has made over the past few months.

And in going forward, I very much welcome the publication of his plan, his framework for taking us forward, last Friday. What people say to me is they'd like to understand more about what that means to them: how we will see the traffic light system be reflected in their daily lives over the coming weeks and months. He's been very clear about not publishing timescales, and I largely agree with that, but I think people would like to feel that they have a stronger indication of where we're going over the coming months—

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:09, 20 May 2020

You need to come to your question now, Alun Davies.

Photo of Alun Davies Alun Davies Labour

I've asked two questions.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

Well, that's fine, then. The First Minister can respond. First Minister.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour

Llywydd, can I thank Alun Davies for the assistance he has given, alongside his colleagues, in reflecting the views of the people that he represents? Because one of the core reasons why we are taking the approach we are taking is because of the very firm indications we were getting from the population of Blaenau Gwent and other communities that they were fearful of an approach in which lockdown would simply be lifted and we would return too quickly to the way things were before. We've listened very carefully to those views, which Alun Davies and others have faithfully represented to us, and it's made a real difference to our thinking. I can give him a complete assurance that we will continue to exercise our own judgment as to the right measures and the right timetable in which to implement them here in Wales.

And what I would say to those people who want to have more definite ideas of how we will move through the traffic light system is that every three weeks we have to report on the state of the regulations; every three weeks we are able to make adjustments to them. It will be Friday of next week now—we're halfway through, just over halfway through, the current three-week cycle—and by Friday of next week, we will have had to have made new decisions, which I think will take us further into that traffic light system. People who want to know more, I think, will be able to see—every three weeks at a minimum—how we plan to move Wales along the pathway that we have set out.

Photo of Lynne Neagle Lynne Neagle Labour 2:11, 20 May 2020

I was very pleased to hear the First Minister referring, again, in his statement, to children and young people. The impact of this pandemic on children and young people is immense, and I believe it will be very long standing.

I very much welcome the announcement on Monday of the £3.75 million extra funding for children's mental health, and particularly the recognition by the education Minister that, for younger children, traditional counselling is not necessarily an appropriate approach, and that the Government will work with providers to deliver services in line with the reforms that are already being taken forward.

Can I ask whether the First Minister agrees with me that in spending that money, it is absolutely crucial that we build on the whole-school approach reforms and the wider system-wide reforms set out in the committee's 'Mind over matter' report? And would the First Minister agree with me that as we come through this pandemic, our 'Mind over matter' recommendations across Government will be more important than ever before? Thank you.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 2:12, 20 May 2020

Thank you, Llywydd. I thank Lynne Neagle for that. Our own chief medical officer has emphasised, right through the coronavirus crisis, that it is more than just a physical illness. And while we can count, so sadly, the number of people who've been admitted to hospital or gone to critical care or, indeed, have died from the virus, it's more difficult to count the impact on people's mental health and well-being, but that harm is very real as well.

I thank Lynne Neagle for what she said in welcoming the £3.75 million. As she knows, it extends help lower down the age range. To be six years old and to have gone through three months of coronavirus is a huge proportion of your lifetime, and the impact on that young person, that child's life, will indeed, I think, last long beyond the current crisis. So, that's why we were keen to put that investment in now and to do it exactly in the way that Lynne Neagle has said: in a way consistent with all the other measures we have taken in recent years to make the whole-school approach, to put the mental health and well-being of young people at the centre of the way that we think about public services and their needs for the future, and that's exactly what we intend to do.

Photo of Gareth Bennett Gareth Bennett UKIP 2:13, 20 May 2020

Thanks to the First Minister for today's statement. First Minister, in the past, you've spoken about the need for a common approach from the four nations during this crisis, and you've made reference to that again today. Now, clearly, First Minister, when we come to the end of this crisis, lessons will need to be drawn from it. Could I ask you if, on reflection, you feel there are any circumstances, during a national emergency, when it is right for the Welsh Government to voluntarily surrender powers back to the UK Government?

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 2:14, 20 May 2020

Well, Llywydd, that wouldn't be my approach. Where we agree with what the UK Government is doing, as we have in huge amounts of what has happened over the recent months, we can simply exercise our powers in a way that is consistent with what is happening elsewhere. There is certainly no need to surrender powers; it's just a matter of how you choose to exercise them.

Photo of Carwyn Jones Carwyn Jones Labour 2:15, 20 May 2020

[Inaudible.]—Can you hear me now?

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru

Yes, we can. Carry on.

Photo of Carwyn Jones Carwyn Jones Labour

Thank you very much. Llywydd, you'll be very glad to know that I don't intend to try your patience this week with a very long question, if that, indeed, is what it was last week, so I'll be short. But just, very quickly, I'd like to remind the leader of the Brexit Party that, far from the British Prime Minister being stripped of powers, the people of Wales decided in 1997 and 2011 in referendums that, in fact, it was the Welsh Parliament and the Welsh Government that should exercise powers in the field of health.

Secondly, I do deplore the desire by some to see Westminster as always right. It's a sign of an inferiority complex, I think, that we have in Wales that, somehow, if England decides to do something different—it was England that broke ranks, not anybody else—then, therefore, they must be right and everyone else must be wrong. It's time to cast off those chains. 

My question is this, First Minister—we know that people are able to play certain sports and to take part in certain activities, providing, of course, that social distancing is respected. My question is this, then: golf clubs and tennis clubs have been mentioned, and there'll be other sports as well, but where people need to drive to get to a facility, as long as that facility is outdoors and as long as that is their nearest public facility, or the nearest facility where they are a member, which is the case of a club, would it be possible to give consideration as to whether further guidance might be available in order to help people in those circumstances? Clearly, we don't want people driving very long distances, but there'll be some activities, inevitably, where people will need to drive to get to them. It's impossible to make rules for every single circumstance, I understand that, but perhaps, First Minister, if not this afternoon, some consideration might be given just to making the situation a little clearer for those people.

Photo of Mark Drakeford Mark Drakeford Labour 2:16, 20 May 2020

Llywydd, I thank Carwyn Jones for that. I agree with him that you can't have a rule for every occasion, and each of us, as citizens, have to make some judgments about our own conduct, and judgments within the ambit of the rules as laid down. So, further guidance—we can certainly look at that, but this afternoon, I'm very happy to say to people in Wales that there are only three questions they need to ask themselves: are they going out to exercise? If it's exercise, then they've passed the first hurdle. Is it local? And if it's local, they've passed the second hurdle. And is that exercise capable of being organised in a way that respects social distancing? And if they can say 'yes' to those three questions, then they've gone a long way, I think, to making the sort of judgment that they need to make as to whether or not what they propose is within the rules as we've agreed them here in Wales.

Photo of Elin Jones Elin Jones Plaid Cymru 2:17, 20 May 2020

(Translated)

I thank the First Minister.